A conversation with...; Carlo Maria Giulini, part two

Here again is our own department you suggested earlier that you might approach. Score in general a little differently than say a very recent contemporary work. Do you have any difference in the way you. Tackle the preparation of the modern school or the contemporary score something like NONO NO NO NO. The music's problem left. Me. I conduct the course of the night was young. When music was more than music. Also music that in the. First moment they couldn't really distant and distant I mean and just an interest of the interest of the discord of course as a. But to see it was in same kind of music could come out. But

now I'm in and say that I can really show it and then I. Try to conduct the music with not only mad but I laugh. Which is different. Because the music that if I listen to. I can enjoy that but only through my my mind with this in my being. But this is not enough for me. When I perform. When I perform I have to believe in this music completely not only be a mutation of my intelligence but I have to leftist music and believe in these. Otherwise I don't. Who are the the new. Let's say 20th century Italian composers who. For whom you have this. She was a I think. And scores

because she is one because you were doing the trusty work here which you first. Yes he just isn't good TV because it was sitting there because it didn't want to hear. He's not done. Here is a no brainer is there were a few recordings some years back but I don't recall having ever heard of it and in this country I would mount a pair o money. Yes of course. You see when you said names the ceiling of the range of the forget something but yes I like my better better much you know money paid out. Look the thing that's a good note lady but not every think it's a high class but I should think I have been very very good and he said it's then he it this and that. He has very clean physiognomy in the musical production of this bit.

He's essentially symphonic. No this extent is only very good chamber music. Jimmy was into Iraq that us quite got there but I think to go in there but but and which are not that is really related to going to like that better than. The LA piccolo and elliptical is a good composer you know. So great because it didn't. Work so that I think that really important books and to contemplate any production sometime he's ready to say we got the king and the GF on duty. Didn't. This is the moment in which I don't like him very much but.

Then he says he feels free and he does his musical expression with. Freedom in his day. The trust is one who has taken this topic a funny idea but he has modified it. Yes but you know the concerto which I am playing these the fog on Showtime and he has seven more clinch it. He's going to. Have a say said to him that they can say Here too high for me. I can I can't because. I. Am musical live. That is not. Paid to do. Really. I said before I

do feel into last. New Way of to music going to say that upstate new generation will and distant but that's it to do. Well that. Raises a question. Electronic music do you feel the same way about that. You know it's funny music. First of all I think that the work music is not that. Because. For music perhaps dance and think that this. Close in the experience say saying. Get it easy was the modern music in the house. Now. You can speak from about electronic sound. What would be done better than sound. I think once in Holland with a very

diligent composer and intersect it is a you know electronic. Instrument. Now it's unlike the first. Not more it's less than a lot of people to commit. And in competition with the poetry. Now they are starting. And what did happen that is new with the new production of sound that nobody can know and of course that are beautiful. I think the very interesting but. Until now I think that. Effect since they did the scenes off feeling. Yes it's not just the attics after this. Emotion. Is more a feeling like you feel like you feel. It's a physical pleasure.

I don't know if they can think that I should know I think I understand exactly what you mean. And I think in a sense when we say Just think so yeah we need to be in the US this good cheer don't sing so there's the justice and. Your first conducting. You remember you remember when you first had the opportunity to conduct this test. Then it was good and. They try to put small things together. And they had to conduct. And I was ready as you can imagine that was very very exciting very emotional for this first of the person and they went there for business. And that was one play with the other but that didn't come at the end this was my first experience with one player look at this and that was it since the CD

he hadn't even in this. Let's see now many lives and more of them you know that you remember your first professional engagement. Oh the first Professor thing is a nice reading incidentally. Beautiful moment for me. Because. I was the first conductor who conducting room after the debate. The British film. Because as I said I van price in them and this money night it goes on. In the last competition and the price you say plays lies of this. This can cause Of course concert in the normal season isn't that easy to go unsaid. But when this happened. In drawn last adjournment the fishies. I was really not ready. Friends you put these people into a bus. It wasn't obvious. And then they looked at me into I asked my wife

very Since nobody knows and but they must in a room with a loss not told one day after the liberation of just you and Mick and go. On Demand and. The orchestra was there and they had nothing to do because all the conductors had conduct they fought and didn't wouldn't stand between a conductor who conduct before from the. Past regime and then they don't like. But perhaps just this man. The titles and a telephone you have a husband and said he see and this I can leave you conduct next to today's And this was the task. Of most of our games experience. Yes it was played on that concert it was such a significant one to Jimmy and he can git very good Italian. The new composition but knew the mother composed but there was a young composer who died to that you said you just the name is accountable

enough but I say that because of this image but he died very young so to delay it get it get a talent. And then the symphony. Yes. What about young conductors. In Italy today. Are there are that conductor coming up. Yes yes yes. We will be hearing moodily. You know Americans don't know as much I think about the Italian orchestras with the exception of a handful. Of rather small handful. As they do about secondary orchestras and in some of the other countries. And this probably is attributable to a number of things but in recent years we've we've been having more opportunities to hear both on tape and records. Some of the radio orchestras of Italy and so on. And I think we're we're knowing a

little more about. What goes on in Italian music but over here in the past. I think we have been given. The impression that. Italians are wholly preoccupied with. With operatic music. No no this is not right. Of course you need to be in his. Room to you and I think to do that I still think to this NG that who produced that. But there. Really good Symphonic Orchestra. They do. They did a scene for next seasons and in some funny music is very very interesting. Is there one symphony orchestra in Italy which. Is preeminent. I think in this moment. In the Roman ID orchestra. Which

is. Standing. But there is something she didn't get to steal and then that idea has to be OK. And in Torino and then if you didn't see the cast and it's you get into it because the last girl is a very good August of course. Is most of your activity now centered at. La Scala. No no. This year. After I leave here in the states to go to London in the coming gun for the new productions that are yet introduced performance for ready to stop my. Activity to conduct that anymore for then a few years and only concerts. Yes. Had you been in the United States before coming to Chicago or was this your first one. No I don't mean. I

phrase that badly. Did the Chicago engagement this time begin. You are you're a stay here. No no I want to find Pittsburgh in Pittsburgh. Yes I had to concerts and it's been. As an editor Chicago you're going to run that a lot know I have one weekend and then I have only one we get the rest and then to do it on the lawn. Yes. What other American orchestras have you. Conducted. In Boston. I. Wasn't going to go because. It's not very much time to spend in the States. Because I'm so so. Close to You gotta go get that and I laughed that much an admonition to guess that. The homeless asked when they had the time and then I went out

to both of them to. Do Next. Yes and it was really extended to me to the states. You will be doing. Concerts in England this. Year and all they say is they say that in. The opera house the other half concerts Yes granted to music to nothing in Festival Hall Yes it's new for them. Hell are you going to be involved with some of the summer festivals this coming summer. Yes. I've been. In Because you know in some of. It i. Have to say can save the time for me I said. As I said before. I. Think it's not as if I don't I don't like to conduct too much.

Because I really. I couldn't have and. Never do impression that I am doing in Joplin they conduct I feel that it has to have to be on us and get emotional at that experience. Then I can do so much and in summer time I need time for I do this festival but I'd like them a treat in the first about and. A constant in months ago which is a very good concert season. But. I'm good. I judge from that that you would. Then find it rather restricting. To hold a permanent conductors post and. Bear the major responsibility for the whole season. Yes this is what I mean. I don't. Since many. Of us as you know in this Gallup moment from. 50 to

55 about two years. But then I because. I preferred to stay for I like to work. So 3 weeks just like I do here. So these dime do good to good and do good music. After all a scholar was it that you. Worked with Maria call us. Yes in scholarly Yes I worked I looked at the list of most of the list. We didn't complete new production working very very hard and in absolute idea the speed of collaboration and perhaps the most beautiful remember of his dime piece and your production of stuff yet at the heat. Of the day and gone to production look you know he's going to know. And to be a producer and a medic I listen to I. TV exclusive in a room where I can just be fucked to start that has

just you know them taking over and toss it and she was really great to get it. The celebrated temperament that we hear so much about apparently was no problem at all. Oh known because in the book I don't know what's happened because then I didn't I had no inimitable Tony to work together. But so long and so far that he worked together. She was marvelous in or didn't mean after what she wants him I was just very very very fine Hooman and the dick beaded of discipline and collaboration. You mention Visconti you and he collaborated on a number of productions. Yes very much. The next also for the next I think of it. I have a great of munitions on him because he's not only a very good producer he has a very fine

musical sensibility. And order to the action of his family he has the right feeling custom of the time and it didn't mean that he knows what's happened. Cutler got the. Atlas knowledge to do so particularly Italian opera than someone else did. German did you do all all styles all national. Not as I didn't I didn't back in the 40s and but you've got sort of seen and. Known never pitching. But I did I did this I have something different just wrench things in the bathtub. So I don't talk to the Blue Moon. You also did some early things like like the Cali Cali

don't know it's beautiful up there that are very bitter. I did this in my gym was Gallant's influence. Is this about Sir idea from just cause it yeah didn't I say what you liked often I do it again and this is better that it beautiful. Yes I think they're great to get it. Dramatic intensity. New clothes you've done the coronation of Petunia. Yes well duty to the US which was done here. Lyric last years. What about the Israel Philharmonic have you. Oh yes doctor did frequently very very frequently Yes I go there every year for one month. Since I live in it. Just as I come from there I was in generally and I like their mark their musical life in this in this country and OK it

is very good as you know I came with them in the 1960s Yes but the musical life and in there he said you need a absolute unique exterior experience because if you think that in this mall County they have 50000 subscribers and that every concert that you have to repeat nine ten eleven years and then they was obliged to divide this subscriber because that August that they can't play of course of the conductor and Soliz twelfth time to time. Once I played the travel times there the exhibition of themselves and now they're divided into three and there are people who think for years that her subscribed this that I'd like to think.

How does the price of admission there compare was something like Chicago. I am afraid I can answer this question I think but it's not it's not the not the easy prices and not cheap not cheap and because they know about the properest is that goodness people that the music is not. When enjoyment is needed to the pleasure of going to the bridge what him and his absolute the necessity you know like the air to breathe take a breath like one. They need music. And they get music. I remember was when they did a bit of a performance once in a the gym so that was there and we did not succeed. And most run and you know they did to people who said that bit us on the street you know. He wrote the tickets for 14 performances and

I think he was obliged to start his distress to think this but they said this is once in their life to have to put on a to do list and do not if you get most and that's if you go to 14 and he bought the ticket for thought to the fans you can imagine a thing and this was at a concert performance on the Nationals. And I said before since we did earn the man in a room with a view to everything as. Part of the go ahead there isn't. You couldn't perhaps diagnose this need for music so that we could find out how to cultivate elsewhere. But what is this you know need they need it comes from a different reason to think the first is that it's a population who comes from the great suffering experience great second experience in which they're not today younger generation of course about them. But the generation

who did this country comes from their experience in which. In the music they find it. But absent a doctor engineer and lawyer what do you think they went and they walk under and under siege. They did some thinking hand work and so on and then they signed it here. Compensation. There in the earth and it tilted but space didn't immunity because of ghosts but UPS there's And then. Did the younger generation to music going in like it. And. Then to have music everywhere. And then there in the day the earth gets to hold the mended it used to send us to the theft down but up to speed just. Using their cost as a percent Some think their musical sense and think very. But is it a large auditorium. It's a very large and one often hears beautiful of the totem that

you can because before to be this. Is was a small. Whole and beautiful. But then they with the help of Vesta Ford said this man was they can mean Philadelphia who gives great a lot of money for this but they take the same thing everywhere over and they work to study all the new books and concert halls and then to be the sole which is the beauty of very very few to go to clues to who is typically a dame de was not better in the beginning but in truth now is very good. Very beautiful and very comfortable. How does it affect you and the musicians. There's a necessity to repeat a program. Eight or nine times in order to. Satisfy the wishes of the great numbers of people. Does it after a time

tend. To drag somewhat up on you. You know. No. No I don't I answered I'm around you have the same kind of intense involvement that I leave it. I think I can say if. All of this because you know this is you never can say if you get these. But I try to get honest now you know. Also when we did it was 52 concept and they said remember August that that this 50 second concert is the most important. Event you have to go. Think to go up it doesn't matter where we play then we play New York won't you go in the gut. Doesn't matter doesn't matter. Music is music ever you do you need the same the same the concentration some of. Their dedication. You're speaking of the tour of the Israel Philharmonic you. Conducted that

was about 1960 there was. This. Reverse it was a tour around the world because we started from. That is we did just it's about here and then went to Jepp and then chickenshit concerts in India. Did you notice a difference in the acoustical properties of orchestral stuff. Yes. Am I. I felt some difference. But. It's funny. I don't know what's happened but something must be happen because last night. I said something different. And in the goods I mean improvement of butter. Yes. Some think it relinquish that second. But they have done something because yesterday I felt as. I said to the assembly. In general they can

say that there but my impression was in competition with their past experience that the sounds that are very beautiful but. This things in the last elite just billions. As they insist. But the quality that is beautiful and the sound is beautiful. But perhaps this thing's lost in the. Light. Yes. And to say they had the impression that the lights come but if they did something. Like you Mr. Giuliani this has been very interesting. Thank you very much. As we show you and looking forward to seeing you again. Thank you so much for being with us. So that had to be saved. This has been a conversation McConnell money a Giulini distinguished Italian conductor participating where Aaron Parsons program annotated with the Chicago Symphony Orchestra. And professor and chairman of the department of theory and composition of Northwestern University's School of Music.

And George Noam program director of Zenith radio corporation's radio station W.E. EPP am this program was distributed by national educational radio. This is the national educational radio network.