Voices of Europe; Ailo Maegaard and Sven Fisker

Voices of Europe Milton Mayer American author and lecture broadcaster and professor in the Institute of Social Research from Frankfurt University today interviews to Danes in the heart of Copenhagen's great shipping district. He speaks with Herr ILO ma Gore for 33 years the general manager of the Danish ship owners association. Born in a small town in Denmark of a family of merchants and seamen here Margo or was trained as a lawyer he is now a member of the board of the international shipping conference of the international shipping Federation and of the International Chamber of shipping. Here is Milton Mayer. Everybody there are. What does Denmark live on. One can hardly say that Denmark has been particularly favored from the hand of nature we have no value of wrong materials such as coal or oil or middles in the Danish underground our main asset is our side which is the base of our

farming industry this side however is not particularly felt in itself and needs yearly. A big contribution of 30 allows us which generally have to be imported from foreign countries. We have given all of that sort of acid and that is a good democratic structure and position of our country. If you look at a map you will observe that few countries if any are more than Denmark the Kingdom of Denmark consists of the opinion if you will after Atlanta and 190 inhabited items. No the power of the council is more than 70 miles away from the nearest sea shore this size. The easy access to the sea. The position of Denmark right on the important commercial shipping link between Nazi and aborted. I forced excellence natural conditions for shipping and sea borne trade. It's going to do to these natural conditions that

Denmark as far back as history goes. That is up to about 800 after Christ each of the Vikings has been a nation of seafarers and on Russia maybe less truly leaches always been an important factor in the English economy. And there are plenty of the Second World War. Then most merchant fleet has a gun to the tonnage of about 1.1 million tons which meant that Denmark proportional to the population here is the fourth place among the seafaring nations of the world. Next to Norway. Great Britain and Holland. This suggests to me aromatic are something about the Danish character that a nation can be said to have a character namely that all the Danes have certainly preserved their national integrity. They are really an international people.

Yes of course they are an international people. When you have walked in the streets of Copenhagen and for instance ask for the nearest way to your hotel you are possible to have observes that most people understand you and are able to answer you in English to know from other languages is not only natural but also necessary for the population in small conses which depend on connections with you who were out. United States however is a very big self-supporting and independent country and your people need only to know their own language that Assad is apt to be that he becomes isolated not internationally minded and a little without compensation of the difficulties of other nations. Here America are what did the ordeal to the Danish shipping the second world war put a stop to a very satisfactory development when the

Danish owners were in the midst of an extension. And when you were of the fleet the German occupation occupation of Denmark the 9th of April 1940 completely changed the status of the shipping and for a time conditions look quite catastrophic. By the German aggression the Illuminati lost control of two thirds of the targets which were outside of German controlled territory and nearly on one of these ships soon save for the light Nations there were losses were very considerable and nearly half of our national fleet was lost. Inclusive many of our newest and most efficient ships Mornac later proved that the loss of ships now there are lots of costly heavy loss of life caused by the war. About 1500 Danish seamen perished and how far has the reconstruction of your shipping progressed. Since only abrasions alteration on the 5th of May

1945 the Danish ship those heavy gray energy side to rebuild the fleet mainly through new constructions from Danish and foreign shipyards and we have now succeeded you know storing a fleet to its prewar size and even a little about that bad. As to quality there is still some way to go until the war losses have been restored as the fleet now comprises more of the ships before the war. In this connection I should like to stress that the reconstruction program has been carried out and financed by the private owners themselves. Danish shipping do not have they do not want government subsidies or any Danish national cleverness but rely entirely on the only necessity of incompatibility. And to what extent does the Danish economy depend on world shipping rather than on the export and

import trade. Shipping has in the years after the war. Been one of Denmark's most prominent export industries in the modern which in proportion to the invested capital and number of employees procurers the largest amount of foreign currency for the country. Today Danish shipping is only to our small extent based on the whom they had as a fleet is mess bigger than required by our own imports and exports and more than two thirds of the total amount of slaves are in international fields. How important shipping is to Denmark's economy. You realize when I tell you that then most visible imports for many years have exceeded exports this has contributed greatly to our comparatively high standard of living and that it has been possible to balance of foreign account in spite of its

rate deficit is due to the so-called invisible exports of which this shipping revenue is by far the most important. Especially in 1951 when Denmark's terms of sage developed Valley unfavorably we do a tremendous rise in the prices of raw materials only for today's medicine fleeting thought in foreign currency. We are one of the few bright parts in 1951. It is estimated that the grass roots of the day he's Musson street amounting to more than 1200. One must excuse me one million two hundred million crowns the fourth powers of which amount was around in United States Dollars which makes our shipping the leading export plate a star's hard currency incomes are conserved and the immediate future here my guard has a look of dark light or is that

hard to say. It is difficult to answer that question. Nobody within Danish shipping is surplus expected the high rates of late rates of 1951 to prevail for a long time and 1952 showed a very considerable drop in rates at a climb which has brought the phrase down to a level where our own was in some cases have been forced to lay out the older ships. This might be a forewarning of depression but a drop in the race will now finally constitute it says to the Danish shipping trade on previous occasions. It has proved to be a stimulant to the negative and the many modern and efficient ships which in a few years time will be a disposal of the Danish shipping companies should create good possibilities for the companies to a hotel room in the field of competition law uncertain feeling about a future which is place in the deal among Danish It knows

it is due to the increasing flak discrimination which is being introduced all over the world especially Latin American countries have gained their own growing Belgian fleet all possible clever ventures at the cost of shipping into the rest of our countries and unfortunately in the USA getting countries seem inclined to follow their example. As I just told you. Danish shipping and dies no soft preferences of subsidies. We wholeheartedly subscribe to the overly monotreme of free and fair competition on the Seven Seas and it is of firm conviction that discrimination and government subsidizing of mass and fleet to the disadvantage for all mankind will only result in a rise on the cost of international transportation in all of us. Shipping subsidies do not seemed to promote a healthy and efficient industry.

One last question here in my car. How do they present shipping and trade policies of my own country the United States. F back Danish shipping and the Danish economy. Well this shipping policy of United States during the coming years will be a particularly decisive factor for the future of the shipping. Today the United States is undoubtedly number one economy power in the world and no one will deny that this nation has been counselors of its leadership and its your great sense of responsibility not least by the journalists and match play ceded it to the Africans reconstruction of war damaged country in the United States however there is a pronounced protectionist is as it you in the shipping industry as also in all economic fields which can be just expressed in the slogan We will not buy and we will not be served

this like better attitude makes it almost impossible to sell the Danish town politics in the United States today in spite of great plans even the efforts in American shipping their attitude is seen in the efforts to obtain doubters have cities or are artificial stimulants which make Danish and our European shipping interests out of the so-called long range shipping bill for instance contains measures of this kind. Without fearing to be missed understood as to my feelings and sympathies I have the answer. I venture to say that United States trade policy in my opinion is those inductee kind of and shortsighted you are the only request the West European countries to increase their export and shipping service are also exports but at the same time you serve all sorts of obstacles in the way here often and prefer to make

generous gifts to accomplish. We certainly should much prefer to sell her goods and services that are than take charity. This is what I call it article. There is also a short sighted because in the long run it must be detrimental to United States real interests. It has always been good business to buy goods where they can put people where they can be put to use the best and cheapest and sell your goods where the need for them is greatest. That why there is United States standing loss of the biggest losses and other taxpayers money to compete with people who are better qualified in shipping and I find I've been culturally productive using instead of fear of developing the industries which are well famous and he laid them out all over the world. This question has been raised many times and I'm glad to see that was sponsible Americans more and

more of your lies the importance of having a reasonable solution of the problem. This is a more important as it will be to the present political tension between east and west. The Danish export of goods and shipping services to the Ethiopian companies to some degree has been curtailed. Whom to a geographical position. Denmark has normally had here a very big market from which we are able to get many of the wall materials we need. There is of course implies a certain basic quality. You were perhaps thinking that my observations have been valid critical but I can assure you that yes in the spirit of sincere friendship for the great American nation. Thank you cara my gardening farming is the heart of Denmark. Sven Fisker owner of the three hundred thirty three acre farm in the province of North Zealand is engaged in mixed farming like most Danish farmers

with special emphasis on dairy production. Here is Milton Mayer. Her first cat What is the secret. Of the success of Danish farm. Does a question that is a little difficult. Bonsai. Think you could sell it was soon but I would say that the sequel is lying. You know he took a chance. And you know organise a show for merchandising of doing this I think. And. I assumed. That but not doing anything all farming into muck is not done otherwise paid off then you will find it and so many other places in the world and what has education to do with farming. Do you mean that you are training your people. To handle farm equipment better. No. Nothing the first.

Time. Of course all our cultural school's cultural coverage is of the biggest importance to Danish farming. But when I spoke about education I mainly thought so 150 over two from school both in the towns and especially in the countryside. Which were the first foundation. For the foundation of the Danish folk schools. Which have been the very biggest importance. Both to Dany and to front for the tinnies who would see the organisation. And also for the thing this feeling of democracy. I hear first. Wherever I go in Denmark. And whomever I talk to. Sooner or later and usually sooner. I hear about. The Danish

folk high schools what is the connection between agriculture in Denmark. And the Danish folk high schools. The Delhi Commission. Is. That it mainly were the young. From the countryside. That were sent. To our folk schools. And there. Learned about. The different. Problems though at to be of importance to weigh or believing. That there were a lot of problems connected to the life. Of the economy. They learned about a lot about the daily story. That they'd learned about. The connection. Between the individuals and the society. From the west we learned only through school. We

saw the importance and this to city. In a population of small room plus if we should be able. To. Build up. A duction of uniform and improved and the mother spent with us. And. Through that it was creating a wall for school. Or your own to learn to manage and to care on the OWN of concessions and institutions. Soon you will find a very little official influence in what we have of the cultural and formal organizations in Denmark. Herr Fisk is the cooperative farming organization in Denmark entirely separate then from the government organisation and government subsidy and government

control. Not entirely. We have a little. Government subsidy for Advisory Service. But it was a very little importance and Danny's farm was absolutely we want to keep what we have a lesser system in anyway and also or more merchandising organisations. As their own independent. Family decisions. Why is it half as good that the. Cooperative organisation of Danish farming was developed. It rests bequests. We were changing from the old production of CEOs that stopped and was impossible in Denmark before the competition from overseas countries and changed to this quite new production of improved and their products. And there we

saw. That with this very big number of small holders. Remember. That the half of Danish farms under the house and. Many of them 25 acres. And the other half is below hundred fifty eight cos we have only a few percent more than under 50 acres. Urban population of such small pharmacy as we may call it it was absolutely necessary it. Will cool for a team to make a uniform production and what is the form of the co-operative organisation. Our widely developed is it dual to most Danish farmers along the way. Oh and that way I understand. Where everybody. Of feeding stuffs and fertilizer is very big scale. I would believe about 60 percent of what cool to organization stations and what we sell is about 80 percent sold through Google to. Samus.

Here Fisk. How has the war and the timing of the post-war years affected Danish farming and through Danish farming the economy itself. In my first of all am I correct in assuming that farming is the basis of the whole Danish economy. You want it there. Because about 60 percent a little more. Of the day's total income come from our export of animal husbandry and how has this export. Been affected by the war in the post-war years and how much. Because. We were I was interested to a very high improved production of high quality. And after the war all. Markets have had difficulties is to pay for this products of a high class. So we have a sump up in necessary to look for new markets. You will certainly know that we have been Betty interested in their medical

chief market and hope to still to have some possibilities there. Press and I have come up and that is that the big import import we had before the war of concentrates cereals in our case is impossible today. For the first we can really only applied in the dollar country and in many of the countries where they produced these oil cakes and seals before they used them themself so we had to change the bases for production of our marriage much from an import of feeding stuffs to a production on the basis of whom groom feeding stuff instead of those chains that will say from serialism on cakes to photoshop eats. Potatoes and inside it has of course been difficult. It was all custom

the oil we were used to that we have to learn the new and it has also been expensive. Especially through all the machines that have been necessary for these new productions and how you come through this changeover is the agricultural economy in Denmark today sound. Attenuate. If we look for that of course we will see. That we have now. A little production of a cultural products in Denmark that we had before. It was at foam a lot due on the wall. But you live by the Denmark lives by the export of its farm products does it not here Fiske it and isn't it getting more difficult to export to England to the United States and the other natural markets for you. It is clearly difficult. Because. The most of the European country has. Their meat or

products very much. But many of them not been able to appreciate these products of all high quality. So we have not in the room. Have the problem to produce. But we have also had the difficulty to produce it cheap enough. And in this way we until now. Have succeeded the other when we think. And butt in our problems we have been bred it been very im. Thankful and thats been a pretty big importance with a Marshall 8. We got to the things under control to make it possible to make this change mentioned and to what extent did your export trade in agriculture depend on selling to countries in the East or in Asia that is the so-called communist or iron curtain countries and has that fall and that all.

It has for them. We are a little we get a little. They have a little difficult to. Apply Directly. I think we have a sort something of a culture machinery. We have so far and also sold a little of all putatively products and we have got something of suitable sun feeding stuffs and cool from there. Have the political difficulties between the east and the West interfered with your export relations to the east. It has undoubtedly of us if we not have had these political difficulties we would have had a much bigger trade with the East. Would you yourself want to go on with the same amount of trade with the East that you had had before. Of course we would like a very big connection with the East. We would first of

all we're on the happy moon quarrel and look difficult as good against East as losing is an inquest. That is my best way to answer that question. And here Fisk. Would you say that the. The polity that is the democracy of Denmark has been in any way influenced by the development of the post war world crisis. Are the Danes afraid and is it affecting the historic democracy of your country. We may say that these last it will shuns a political as to impact the Danish police population and then his democracy entirely to give up. But I can say

that we are living in the permanent flood in Denmark. We have been used for thousands of year to up big and strong. Maple. Who we are often now frightened. So this question is not new to us. And. But another thing is that we clearly see. The importance and the City of connection between all the European countries in any way in trade as well as in defense. When you say air fares all of the European countries do you mean a Western European block. Apart from South America. And the Communist East. Or do you mean a Western alliance including the United States. Or do you mean literally all of the European countries including the communist countries.

It is a difficult question. The only possible we can say you see today is the connection between the best and European countries. With a very India connection of course to the United States too. And then we are hoping that we're still stupid able to increase which this collection is covering. Thank you very much. Yes. In this recorded program Milton Mayer has been interviewing two Danes hair I don't mug or and here's Ben Fisk. This program has been made possible under a grant from the fund for adult education an independent organization established by the poured foundation. These programs are prepared and distributed by the National Association of educational broadcasters. This program was introduced by Norman McKee and this is the end E.B. tape network.