Weekly Evening Exchange; 13197; News Analysis

Alexis Herman to be secretary of labor and President Clinton says mistakes were made on campaign donations. All Up next on the weekly news analysis. The. Evening and welcome to the evening Xchange weekly news analysis. I'm Cojo Nom the will. Virginia has decided that it doesn't like the state song. Take me back to Old Virginny anymore a long time after black people decided that they didn't like it. And 60 Minutes has decided that it doesn't

like the Bill Cosby interview anymore and has decided to drop it. But there are many other important issues in the news that we will be discussing tonight with W am you political correspondent and Legal Times columnist Mark Plotkin. Joined by Bob Reynolds of the runner's News Service and Askia Muhammad of the Washington informer newspaper. President Clinton held his first news conference since his election this past week and he was pummeled with questions about campaign donations and where have we heard the phrase before. Mistakes were made. The president however says he's looking for campaign finance reform and then took off after that press conference to a major fundraiser that evening that the Democrats held so that is one indication of his dilemma. But how is he handling this. Well you know I I watched that press conference and I think that he was obviously prepared for these questions. And so there was part mea culpa. Yes we did wrong. Yes. The controller of the currency shouldn't have been there. He was

prepared for the question that said Oh aren't you tonight going to the National Business Council which you're going to raise $10 billion. So he said it's not a question of how much money is raised. And then he had sort of the sort of the response which was supposed to silence everything everybody who came here not once did you did anything because they were there. Did I say do something. Because if it don't it. These are sophisticated people in Washington. The point is you don't have to say anything. That's really the point. So I thought he really didn't do a very good job of deflecting it. He gets points for at least facing the issue. I think that the shame of it is that what we have is a white sail. Things are up for grabs. It's up for sale. If you have money come on in to the link it will here have a chair. This is the kind of more and where the ethics are just out of the window. Now with the Democrats only the Republicans do. And what happens is

corporations money have access. But supposing for example you a good reason the Earthman are forbidden from going out. Well by federal law it's not. But I'm talking about have I said you know corporations have accelerated what I said to what I said corporations heads of corporations had access. And when you are talking about issues that are relevant to the homeless to poor kids you know they don't they don't have a ghost of a chance of getting in the room to a coffee klatch or any other kind of meeting. And so you know it's just a shame that you and hear that maybe it's up for grabs. The argument is skewed in favor of the rich and it clearly is. And when you have managing partners of these corporations and these consulting firms writing these fat checks obviously this is not coming out of their personal war chest out of their kids endowment funds for their scholarships for going to state college or state

you know this is coming out of some large Yes from the corporation and when they go and meet with the president they're going to talk whatever the agenda is that is in the interest of the company that help them be so well endowed us to be able to write these fat. Well the president says in his defense that the problem with all of this is that these campaigns now cost so much money and then they have to be competitive and they have to be competitive. What is the reasonable expectation that we can therefore expect elected officials anywhere at any time to pass serious campaign finance reform. I was mistaken and I apologize to Barbara because there are corporate contributions are allowed under this rule which is the giant loophole. I saw it on my record which means that you know supposedly after Watergate you know they have this wonderful era where you would be limited as a human being to give one thousand dollars and there would be disclosure. But then this giant loophole was created which I think you didn't have to be a political scientist to

figure out would be taken advantage of massively that you could give an unlimited amount of money. And corporations are not forbidden. They can actually give contributions under this wonderful thing of party building activities. So the checks go straight to the parties and that's what these coffees were supposedly. They sent the money to the to the party and then the party dispensed it any way that they wanted. But I think when it comes to in response to your question nobody is trying to answer this question as long as you all have been you know certain no candidate is going to say I will lead by example except I think what somebody only took a hundred dollars. Was it Paul Wellstone or somebody. But most in in the in the president feels that he's also the leader of the party besides being the chief executive the leader of the pack. And that's what we're going to have to get rid of to to ban PACs you know to to free television

ads. Maybe when you say that we are meeting with our elected representatives because it would appear that I did not do that. That's what they would do that I'm talking about that that the public can not allow this to be just a lot of house smoke and fire and let them go on and just this is business as usual. Barbara it's out of the public's hands. In the famous words of Charles Keating the convicted bank swindler let's say when asked who was he buying influence when he gave 100 million dollars or a million dollars to the Keating Five. The famous senators on Capitol Hill. What do you think you were buying influence. So I better hope I was. So I just don't see that Denham is John Breaux the senator from Louisiana. When asked about contributions to give given to his campaign he said this is your vote for sale. No but it is for Rand. So there is an admission that

this is the way the system works. I hope that there will be no solution from just the sake of the voters want because it's out of the voters. I don't think it is ever that the voters had. I think at each turn those congressmen still have to come back home to face the vote. And I think that nobody is defeated because they spent too much. Well I don't know about you but we are tired of late I'm just held to more or rather he was somewhere where where you know everything is. I think people are. What's your response. I was just what is the solution the because it seems like the solution is only human beings can vote only human beings can contribute. And that way the money would have to come up the soft money would go out of the way of the PAC contributions the corporation or PAC can't go to the polling place at precinct 27 that Johnny in school and vote. So the visual name is zero here. And their donations would be limited. That's to the sounds like something in the District of Columbia. And we know how far it is going to

go. Well that's a that's they should be Barbree that's a Supreme Court decision where this is flailing. I said they said money is speech. I don't know what to do about it when you write legislation that you go to court again to contest it with UDC has those kind of laws where you can only give one hundred dollars. No no no they will the council revoke that it's back to the old limitation even then we have our ups and then we have a corporate influence free counsel and the mayor's office with legal in the District of Columbia for local elections and they're not supposed to leave until the white Whitehouse database the White House has been collecting the names and addresses of all of the people who have visited the White House who are perceived to be supporters of the president and somehow some way the Democratic National Committee had access to these lists and apparently various individuals associated with the DNC use these lists for fundraising purposes at one time or another. That apparently is not only unethical it is also illegal and the Washington Times reports that Hillary Clinton was the brainchild of this. This whole idea of the database was the brainchild of Hillary Clinton.

That one hasn't been fleshed out completely as yet but here we go again. Well you know who are we kidding. I mean what did you think. The president just picked the chairman of the Democratic National Committee Governor Romer he said this is who I want. There was no I mean the Democratic National to think that there isn't collusion that there isn't sharing of information. I'm not talking about the ethical connotations of it. They were in our tax dollars are paying for this data that we wish to use the next. Sort of like an explosion of what's called the World Wide Web the Internet that is running rampant. Everyone has pet has a web page on the Internet. And so why shouldn't the. At the White House have a computer database. Is not on the database why it's just an idea and why the president is the president and his wife uses it. I'm with I'm I'm with what he's saying because there is no privacy.

I mean even people who are not computer experts can get on the worldwide web and find out your address and find out who your neighbors are. There is no privacy. Why do we single this out. Because it's against the law. The White House but we don't for partisan. We don't know that because we don't know that this was in fact used. There wasn't a retraction. And the DNC official who said that he in fact used this list to sort of back down and said Well I'm not so computer smart. Maybe it wasn't really what I thought it was that I was really using maybe it was something else and maybe I was befuddled by the gimmickry of the of the of the of the computer so we don't know that this has happened yet. It appears only because so many other murky things have gone on that it appears that this is just yet another instance of the White House bending the rules in favor of sleazy fundraising and it is precisely the murky nature

of these problems that is muddying the waters in which Alexis Herman is trying to swim safely to her nominee to her appointment as secretary of labor because as White House public liaison she is now involved in the controversy with the invitation of the Comptroller of the currency to the White House at the same time a number of corporate heads were in the White House she said I did not realize that this was a Democratic National Committee function. Somebody else told me at a later point and I withdrew myself from the occasion but apparently committed to call the controller of the currency at that point. She is also being it is alleged at the end of her tenure as head of the Women's Bureau at the Department of Labor during the Carter administration let out a number of seats or contracts all in a hurry and that one of the companies that got those contracts. Eventually employed her after. I cannot believe that. One hundred and three coffee klatches and all the meetings that. This scandal is going to floor once again. On a black woman. Zora Neale Hurston talked about black women being the mule

of the world. The mills of the world in the end this will not stand. I do think that Alexis Herman will her nomination is in trouble and the rest of them are falling through the White House. So let me see if what I'm saying from the slate of them are going through and the White House has a problem with black women they've had one with John Elder and Lani Guinier. The white sand of Foursquare has heard that before. Yes and I'll see it when I believe it. You know they have abandoned black women before and I think cases in the case of Alexis Herman you know I think it's it's certainly sad particularly at this time when the dean of black politics Louis Martin passed this week he did politics the old fashioned way with a handshake and with a look in the eye and with straight words and straight talk to people going back to John Kennedy and

Johnson Johnson. I mean he went with Jimmy Carter while he was in the white and he was brought into the Carter White House when Carter would seemed to help had no clue as to what was going on in the black community and I didn't think that he needed what is euphemistically referred to as an HNIC in his administration and he brought Martin in. And so in some sense he's the mentor Alexis Herman and all of the black politicians who have risen to some prominence. What does this have to do however with the accusations against Alexa's alone. What I'm saying is that at the time of his passing which is it's ironic that this ironically of all this other slime and bizarre let's not on the fact that that that she bears the brunt of it is just unacceptable. I don't think. I don't think any politician has can say they have perfectly clean hands but I don't think she has dirty hands. I think the one thing that we have tried Laci

met with Trent Lott and Trent Lott seems to have come out you reassured them some of the critics who are hoping that she will go down in flames. There's another constituency that's missing you must remember having nothing to do with race or even gender terms of constituency. No group besides African-Americans was more supportive to the Clinton campaign than organized labor to the tune of spending 35 million dollars. Organized Labor Alexis Herman was not there kind of was not their candidate. And so if she needs allies now I don't know how enthusiastic and supportive they are going to be their candidate was Harris Wofford and the president picked Alexis with a shiver. I don't know why people get over it because she read that she she's a ring to do what she wants out of the Women's Bureau. I mean there's always been a connection between civil rights and labor and we've always been on each other's cause. But I think they need to get with that and understand how

important and relevant she is. She carries on not only the legacy of Louis Martin but also. But she is right in the middle of a political battle the time that the president is caught in it in new shoes the they are all caught in it. So I think Barbara makes a good point more than one good point but the point is the Republicans are going to cause a fuss. They criticize Senator or at least one confirmation fight that size up who the candidates are. And if they think this person is the weakest administration won't fight for that person they're going to pile on. I think you're absolutely correct that Iran needs to put a yoke of financial murky dealings on Alexis Herman. African-Americans are the least generous and notorious for sleazy money deals and political giving. I mean you can't find. Yes. But if you're a hurricane you can count all of the Republican looking on her present

nothing comes. You have to remember that there are those like Barbara in the National Black Women's Political Caucus who have seen what happened to Lani Guinier and who are saying you better not allow this to happen to Alexis Herman and the Republicans are conceivably saying at this point. Well yes if he lets her go then he will be severely damaged among his black. So the irony is that maybe will not run for the for the Other than i really is that if African-Americans are stung in the case of Alexis Herman or Rodney Slater the Ratchet's leaders he said these are the if African-Americans feel stung they will their votes will dry up but not their money way down. The other irony which you did point out which I think is relevant is the reason that she was selected was was supposedly because the president did not want to be accused of buckling under and having the person who is a black woman landing when you're all the and all the people decided this supposedly was the reason why she was selected.

She is very smart. She and she has the experience she has been around Clinton. She was very significant in the DNC and she was Ron Brown's right arm. She's not the Jesse Jackson. Well yeah but the other thing is that the Office of Public Liaison. I mean let's face it is inherently a political job. And this was bound to happen. That's why I think it's much ado about nothing. Anybody who holds that position knows that they're doing something politically. I think that if she becomes the Rodney King of this whole the whole lobbying of this is taking a holiday it is because she's getting a public whipping for all to see. And other people who are deeper in this My than she is are just getting us sailing by and I don't I don't think this is going to stand. Although she will be the owner of the rentals. Yes. This is one of the only token tokenizer Frederico peña is also as the energy secretary designate is sort of a throw away and perhaps if anyone

gets hung out to dry although she's not from this season the trouble is only being kept because he's Latino. Now he's got Don't don't say it in an agency. What is he doing here with vice. Capable or is not has made it hard to get qualifications in the field that he was selected to lead has been sort of that's why he got leader in the race before and was leaving he has traded in lateral laterally for his own lateral point. His only remaining because there would have been no Tino's less act. So I just don't like the people. There is a certain size I think that there is not much for this election and you have to be something for all that training. We have been a mayor. We do talk about the Virginia state song that it's event to them by the Senate of Virginia. And the big business there's no discrimination bias. Stay with us. We'll be right back. It.

Welcome back. Of course this weekend the O.J. Simpson jury is considering whether or not the football superstar will have to pay a great deal of money in the civil lawsuit against him. And as we continue our discussion the jury is still out on this matter. But the latest news is that one member of the jury has been dismissed for not revealing that her daughter happened to be a circuit jury in the state's attorney's office in California. And I guess that's something she should have review earlier earlier the woman who was dismissed turns out to be the only black member of the jury she is being replaced by a Hispanic gentleman we obviously don't know what impact that will have on how the jury considers its verdict with the racial question chronic cropping up again.

And that's likely regardless of which way the verdict goes to be one of the major issues. I don't think you can get away from that the waste problem because you have a police problem and that brings in the race problem. But you know when you look at L.A. and you look at the police community relationship there you know this was one of hostility the Rodney King spectrum holding hanging over people's head. You go to Santa Monica and you see policemen riding around on bicycles and being polite hello how are you doing. And so they don't have this image of of the police. So and then you look at that the foreman of the of the of the jury who likes police and who has said before the criminal trial he thought O.J. you know was guilty. And I think you're going to have I really do think based on the evidence of course that that has not because it does look like he is guilty. You've got the shoes now the glove didn't fit. You're just going to fit the matter of the changing clutch. You know he cut his hand on the glass and then he

cut it in Chicago. Now he he nicked it and playing with with the son. Where was he while he was chipping golf balls. He was a slave. He was in the shower bar but I know you've got on from. You've gone from the police and the judge and the evidence and the set of the jury and the laws that they enact it just so they convict O.J. Simpson. Laws that had never been enacted since the Magna Carta was written back in twelve hundred. And now you're going back to the out of making it sound like the guy's going to get off. And now you're going back to what the evidence says. And it's hard to have it both ways. Now certainly we're entitled to do that. And that's why it looks a lot like he's going to be convicted. I think all of this that the jury I'm the only not. Yes I got an all white jury. You only need 9 out of 12. I mean they pass laws that says a different standard of proof different standard of proof and they've made it they've made sure that every bit of circumstantial evidence that could be introduced could be introduced. And so maybe

some evidence that should this time of course will be heard only in his pocketbook if indeed he loses this case. Yeah. And the question is how much money does he actually have. Can he afford that one. How we all get drawn into this discussion is the cradle to our basis instance we now all are allowed to speculate publicly on how much money he has because that's what they're talking about in court. Well I would just say that the composition the racial composition of the jury will then be if if if the vote is against O.J. Simpson then the line forever never will be. Well when there were nine were there nine black jurors in the in the criminal trial see now there are all these white jurors and only not even one black jurors see does this not symbolize the racial divide in this. Join the conversation both ways and fast. You know I think it's sad that if you just forget about the evidence. I mean people just want to say look at the race issue which which of course is intriguing but there is of course the matter of where was he. And

there still is the issue of Nicole's face beat to a pulp where and when he says oh no I never touched her hair never hit her. You know I mean what do you how did she what would you call this. This purple face that she had. I mean you know there still is the racial question which Johnnie Cochran did a good job with dealing with this one. But there's still the where was he at 10:35 when the murder was committed when we know he was at 11 0 5 getting in a limousine to go to the airport with no blood and no bloody clothes anyway. It seems if you want to go on those sort of circumstantial questions that he would have time by himself to have disposed of. I'm going to go ahead with him then. I mean maybe he didn't do it. Well we will find out when the jury render its decision. Even though this decision is likely to solve absolutely nothing it will merely confirm in the minds of those people who already believe one way or the other that race in the minds of

either a jury is what finally caused the outcome of this case. Speaking of celebrities in the News 60 Minutes has decided to cancel the segment with the interview with Bill Cosby that was done by Dan Rather this past Monday they talked for two and a half hours and CBS News immediately began airing segments of that interview its affiliates around the country. It was picked up by the tabloid shows hard copy in particular and the New York tabloids did a major job with it but they did not seem to be as interested in the circumstances surrounding the death of Bill Cosby's son Ennis but more in whether or not he did have an affair with the mother of the young lady who allegedly attempted to blackmail him. He did in that interview admit to having what he considered what he described as a number of rendezvoused with this woman. Well apparently both Cosby and his agent began to call CBS News and 60 Minutes and asked for that interview to be pulled because of the way in which it was being handled by the

tabloids and frankly because of the way CBS and its affiliates itself handled cuts out of that interview apparently they did not like the idea that the segment of the interview that was emphasized most had to do with the alleged extramarital affair later in the week Camille Cosby issued a statement saying that she and her husband went over all of these issues years ago. They are now unified and it's not an issue anymore. But there are those who argue that look this was a legitimate news story. It was a legitimate interview. CBS is only pulling it because Bill Cosby is the hottest star right now. And because of America's continuing love affair with when he couldn't buy a network. So at least if he could do anything and then this is CBS is his network at least if he could have any clout at all he's able to pull this story from being run. And maybe it was early. He called them rather to do the interview earlier and perhaps that was his way of trying to get over the tremendous pain that must be associated with

the loss of your son and maybe the rest of us can think about that terrible tragedy more and less about his love child or supposed love child of 23 years ago. But you know I just wish there were some more clout left over for the average person who can't get anything pulled from anywhere. They find out anything they distort your reputation your mother your daddy your grandchildren could have you could have you. But this has cost me. Cost me this issue of the woman you know because he was like life with father you know. He was Mr. fatherhood himself. You know you wonder do the men ever keep their marriage vows you know is this the standard I mean if me Mr. fatherhood himself will vouch for me. I mean I mean do you man ever keep your vows.

I don't have to I'm sad for me. I mean I can't help I mean I'm wondering you know who isn't but Barbara is right. The brain which wrote an article in The New York Times I'll have to pirate it because you said it much better than I could say. We have built up these deified these sort of icons and that they don't have any blemishes and I'm not saying that this is not a blemish that it's something more than a blemish. I don't mean that. But we have created these aura around certain people because we see them in a TV show or we hear them on a radio show or we see them on the movie screen that they have no human frailties or family. And so then it's Oh my God what a shock. You said in the green room is there anybody left. No there's nobody left. So why don't we just look at the press look who got elected president. There never was anybody on the view many years ago Bill Cosby said that at one point when offered a choice between his career and his family he would have chosen his career. So the fact that he happened to be the star for 10 years of a show that presented

black family life and a whole segment of the whole country loved was not necessarily his idea of how he wanted to present himself very well. He wrote a book on father. He was like why are you also in the book talks about the mistakes he made as if you didn't talk about the beloved child. This is the idealization of sort of family life I mean we had it when I was growing up it was called Father Knows Best It was called Ozzie and Harriet and he wanted to sort of you thought you were emulating that sort of family. And then you find out about Ricky Nelson you know were having problems and and and Dr. wellby. What's his name. He was an alcoholic. So but there's this transference that because it's on the TV screen. This is a depiction of those people's real life. I think you're being unfair to only hold men up to the standard of purity. And what about fallen women. That's not what any of us want. I think I think in this society in one way yes it's less seemly of anyone

to talk about the moral foibles of a woman in public. And you don't see people talking about well and women are willing to do it because of it because with this grace we know that that's what we talk about a man speaking of women and all of this discussion about the terrible thing that has happened to Bill Cosby that is often forgotten what's happened to Camille Cosby in all of this because not only has she had to suffer the loss of a son but in this situation by this scandal she is taking a double whammy in this case having an unpleasant episode from her past brought up and discussed openly. So I think everybody's thoughts need to be with Camille Cosby at this time because it must be remembered that for all of the credit that Bill Cosby gets for the family is generous donation. Camille Cosby is in large measure the driving force behind all of his crimes. This was 23 years ago and the marriage has been in tact

as far as we know every since. And the issue is is. And who murdered him and who is this mystery woman. I can't get a fix on who is this woman. I've seen it appears from some different places that the mystery woman is the one that was called to figure. Yes Virginia will no longer be longer be and carried me back to old Virginia one of the ironic things about the Senate vote against the state song which so many people found offensive was that a number of black state senators voted against the measure because they did not like the idea that this old song would now become the state song alert to people who wanted to read to me that was. And there's some white senators state senators like Joe Cartland and neighbor in northern Virginia who voted against the vote too because it is unbelievable to me.

If you are going to vote for it you vote. I mean I think they were right. I would have done the same thing. What is this qualifier. It's horrible. It's so awful it is that it be. But it's not so awful and so horrible because we're going to call emeritus emeritus that terms like it's a question of respect and you say as somebody on race in something from history and making dean emeritus or president emeritus I mean to use that word to me it sums up the the I was going to use a profane word but but that just the junk of this silliness of Virginia airiest it sums up Virginia in its absolute worst. Just say we were wrong and we're not going to have anything to do with it. But to hang onto this a Methodist tag is just getting rid of an unpopular employee by kicking him like Wilder started crusading against that song two decades ago.

The space station was something like Massa and Darcie in the sub. If we had words like cracker poor white trash we never have a song like that. You know. And it should not be in marriages. It should be gone and dealt with. I can understand why they built it that way. There you go bashing Ebonics again. I am longing to go where I am belong to go. If you're ever going to be born with it. It would be Fattal's me as to how any self-respecting white legislator in Virginia could vote to keep it because it refers to when I picked time for my son. I mean 80 percent of the people of Virginia aren't African-American. Are not the Senate of slaves. How can they relate to a song that is strictly from the slaves perspective. You know it's about as insensitive as blacks who can't get it when the Native Americans say we don't like the Redskins. You

know what. You know you're right. I mean we this is predominately black. But we never could understand that that we shouldn't have said Redskins. I mean if you want people to say insensitive to you we all have a little sense. So. So the white Southern whites of the South who dressed who defend this song are like the the silly African-American who dresses up in Indian costume in this football game. And I said I was a state senator in Florida who has also now introduced legislation to get rid of that state song which is Swannie and the lyrics to that are also quite objectionable and we'll see what happens. I know this isn't fashionable but I will say something in defense of the former Mayor Sharon Prak Kelly who did not. Who are those who never referred to it as the Washington Redskins but to call it the Washington football team. So let it be noted that someone should be a positive reply and Frenkiel it.

Let it be known as Bursal term to describe that football team. OK speaking of the former mirrorless still a little bit with the District of Columbia and talk about the tax cuts that our D.C. delegate Eleanor Holmes Norton appeared with you earlier w you to talk about the tax cuts which are clearly being opposed by other members in surrounding jurisdictions. But she had said earlier that she would put them under severe stress and attack what's happening with it. Well last year on April 15th on tax day she proposed this bill to reduce the progressive flat tax reduction 15 percent where people who earn less than $30000 a year would not pay any federal taxes and the people who earned other incomes would pay progressively less. She feels that the major question whatever you do is the population drain that we have as many people now in Washington D.C. about 540000 as we did in 1933 and that unless you create a psychological climate to bring people back and to keep people

here and this is the only way to go. She went off a little on her stated message in her able aid Donna Brazil said your stand on the message by saying I'm going against the neighbouring council members. Congressman Moran Marella and Davis who are not jumping to her defense but at the same time don't want a commuter tax so they're saying if you're there you've got to help us in some way. And I get the impression that would if we're a solution in the District of Columbia comes up with a solution that calls for a commuter tax a solution that calls for a tax cut or a solution calls for increased federal payment. Members of surrounding jurisdictions while on the one hand conceding that the District of Columbia needs some infusion of money never seem to be able to agree with any idea that is put forward that you invariably jump on the management side of the issue and say well until it has demonstrated the ability to manage itself

better we will just like starving. You also have to have the correct approach because well some of her measures make sense we have a draining because of number one schools or the quality of schools and we have a drain because of crime. And until you deal with those two issues of crime and education Barber you're still going to learn that we have Franklin Raines on our radio show and I said the commuter tax which could bring 600 the Auclair can report to six hundred ninety one million dollars that goes to Annapolis. Three hundred ninety one million of us goes to Richmond. $20 billion is earned in the district Columbia and be up to 70 percent. Now we can get. And we are prohibited not limited. We are prohibited that is equitable. I think that's wrong. And what we now have with Moran and Marella and Davis the neighbors have veto power over our treasury. That's absurd. And if the president wanted to do something he would make the case that

this is a terrible inequity and appealed to the country. We have a lot now that they're on the committees they said well that's no good. And Steny Hoyer who's not in the can be said that's unfortunate. It's unfortunate we can't get at their money. Now I heard Tom Daschle say that well maybe it might have to one day resort to a commuter tax. And it seemed that perhaps that mentality had absorbed it somewhere or another at some point when perhaps the district is 60 percent white and there are no more black public officials and top leadership positions in political hopscotched they predict that something is going to have to be done like that if not tollbooths on all on New Hampshire Avenue and so on 16th Street and Georgia Avenue and the 14th Street Bridge something that's going to have to be done to tax these commuters who come in use the police use the road use the services every day and don't pay a dime. Well in Sydney for one day today the reports today the Republican leader Trent Lott unlike Mr. Daschle said that the commuter tax is dead. So you know if you

ever read a book called Joe's point is actually right. We were not going to give you the federal payment. We're not going to do the commuter tax but we're going to be nice to you and we're not going to say ugly things like stampers enjoy growing. And you're supposed to be grateful for it. And by the way we're not going to give you a vote in the House and the Senate either. So why don't you just clean up your mess and then we'll address them and every six months we will tell you that there's something else we're prepared to consider and as soon as you begin to consider it we'll say no that's not a good idea anyway. And it so happens that the coffers of the District of Columbia continue to be drained and we are accused of continuing mismanagement even though we have a financial control board in place. We have a school board of trustees in place. We have a chief financial officer Anthony Williams in place somehow or the other. That issue still keeps being raised. We do have to take a short break right now. When we come back we will be talking about the Truth and Reconciliation Commission in South Africa and the fact that four former police officials in that country have confessed to the murder of black consciousness activist Steve

Biko. Welcome back to the weekly news analysis. In the courageous undertaking that the South African

government and its people have been going through for the past several months the Truth and Reconciliation Commission was set up to probe all of the events that may have occurred during the apartheid era that have so far been not fully reported. Well the most startling revelation coming out of the Truth Commission series so far is that four South African policemen seeking amnesty under the Truth and Reconciliation Commissions provisions have confessed to the 1977 murder of black consciousness activist Steve Biko. You may remember him. He was the hero of the movie starring Denzel Washington called Cry Freedom. But in South Africa he was the man who took the place of a band. African National Congress and created a movement called the Black Consciousness Movement. During the mid-70s was the main force of the movement in South Africa. He was taken in and in those days detained then you weren't charged with anything. They just kind

of kept you in jail and he died and the South African government at the time claimed that he died as a result of a hunger strike that he had gone on. Now these four policemen have confessed and they are seeking amnesty which is how this commission thing works. Another call that a courageous process is something of a misnomer. I think the I mean on the part of the South African people don't call on the part of the South African people and courageous process is I think unfair to those who were really bludgeoned into this position almost in the way that Steve Biko was bludgeoned to death by the Afrikaners who said we will not allow full participation of the majority of voters unless there is this truth and reconciliate truth and conciliation Commission which is able to give amnesty to these war criminals in essence. I mean you have these people who are ought to be charged with war crimes. And what they're doing is walking and saying well I did know the big guys are coming in. Dick Clark

is not coming in Vorster is not coming in saying I ordered the death of these people. Please forgive me my fellow South Africans a few police who were ordered by someone to do these heinous acts are coming forward and begging for forgiveness and they will be given amnesty and they won't be fingering the higher ups. And so it does say it's courageous This is a bit unfair because it really is a forced situation on the majority to accept these criminals as normal citizens and still have the murderers among among them. You have to have prosecution. You have to move it in that direction and this is not what what it does but and you know it's very difficult for me to look at what South Africa is doing in and shake my finger when we you know have so many instances where we don't have truth right here. We still don't know who killed our.

We're not going out of Dr. King we have James Earl Ray languishing in jail near death dying the argument that Archbishop Tutu made when he was sort of making it to the end of Steve Biko for instance that you would have never known the truth had there not been this truth because these people would simply never have come forward and that for the public record for the truth to be in South Africa's historical public record it had a plan you have it both ways. Can you have truth and can you have punishment. I think that's the question. But what did you referring to Archbishop Tutu is. Is it in Washington or is it on this show that you're referring to I mean when he spoke at Howard University in Rankin Chapel Hill but is he saying that the resources are such a lack of commitment or what is it that this would never have come out. This is the only way that it would have come out that the powers that be never would have found out who had done it. Is that what he said a lot more than that but he did not say that in specific reference to the Beco case he said it in reference to a lot of the kinds of atrocities that were carried out during the

apartheid regime. He was the one who talked about the Kurds of the South African people. I merely quote him in that regard. My visceral instinct is that if that's what they get off that's horrible you know. I mean that's my visceral instinct is no. Just by saying that you did it it's not like Ptak didn't pay you tax you you killed somebody even though his work I mean. I mean why can't why you know why can't we have the kind of justice that was meted out at No. Quote Bishop Archbishop Tutu again he said that South Africa does not want to find itself buried in the past where they have an ongoing series of prolonged trials and the punishment associated with those trials that gets the whole let's call it just gets caught up in revenge syndromes. You know I can't speak but even the even the ANC is being called to confess so to speak. And many in the ANC feel we have nothing to confess. Our leaders have been struck down. Chris heiny was killed and murdered even since

the time of the reconciliation so-called sorted. I mean it is a bit much and it's it's it's frustrating at best to see that this is really a gesture to keep the a minority of South because you have a purging so you have you know there it is Reverend Wright staying out of purging. But still even with that purging there is a demand for which it will just be the reason why I stood somewhat in admiration of it is because I understand that the priority of the South Africans is to try to build a nation and that the history of apartheid was such a vicious history that to get bogged down in that history can lead to the seeds of division being sold even further and the kind of war and Requiem Requiem recrimination taking over again. There are some who feel that as I it that they bend too far in the direction you know why is this. Because somebody who is Jewish who lives here when they pick somebody up in

Cleveland whether they be a mechanic or something like that and they say whether it be guilty assuming he's guilty and they want to extradite him or the famous example of Eichmann Oh that happened too long ago that what they did was wrong to grab him somewhere else. I mean I was in favor of that. I want to hunt down all those people. I want them to pay the price for what they did. I don't think yours or forgiveness. That's that's what justice is called. I would just add one last thing Donna Woods who the biographer as it happens a radio station NPR and he was talking to things he said interesting first he said that he said that Beco the guard said in the Afrikaners said what are you going to do with this when it's all over. Which was interesting like they knew that day was going to be all right. That day was going to come in second. He felt and this does not excuse it of course. Is it the way that de-code died was not exactly ordered. There was a climate obviously is that these were individual acts but a climate was around. It was an accident. But it was

an accident that they easily allowed to happen. It was a vicious beating. And there are those who feel that these people should be punished for it. I cannot truly put myself in the shoes of the people of South Africa. This is for them to resolve and we'll see how they do resolve this. We do have to move on bias lawsuits discrimination lawsuits seem to be the big thing for lawyers these days. Apparently because of the technicalities of the law you can bill the alleged discriminate Torre for twice as much as you would normally build because of how the law is arranged and a lot of lawyers say this is now the most profitable field of law there is and so we're getting into it. On the one hand people say that's fine because it means that a lot more discrimination cases will get heard. On another hand people say well this wasn't supposed to be the intent of the law. It wasn't supposed to be the lawyers who were making money with the aggrieved party. Well when you look at large corporations and see how diversity is going out of the window and how that they are breaking the law and

they are discriminating Harlem. Well I think you know if if if if they're not going to obey the law. What else do you have. But but but for these these bias to to go forth and I think I think they're good because it sets a fire under them. But when if you understand what they could mean for like with Schoeni a hundred five million dollars was a cost settlement. The lawyers walked away with what 20 million dollars to people 20000 people were supposed to share and five thousand dollars they didn't get it. But what they did they created a climate that Schoeni had to deal with their employment and contractors and the class action suits are really for the for the future. I mean this is this is the way I see it to stop the practice and this set a new climate that won't be out of our practice. Besides chasing ambulances or as they say it beats working for a living.

Oh you cynics will say the trial lawyers were the largest contributors to the Democratic Party and if you didn't have lawsuits like this then the Democratic Party couldn't get financed. Good to be here the media were saying things. But there's I always there on contingency. They wouldn't take the case any other way. They have the incentive to take the case. It wouldn't take the case you built in a way by which lawyers take a case that they ordinarily wouldn't take. I mean you know it's highway robbery and symbolize of course that getting $600 an hour. You know the the you know it is it is just another way of robberies. Corporations when when they make these agreements Shoney's Denny's all these guys Mitsubishi when they sat up with Reverend Jackson and the vice president of sales to say all we've agreed to we're going to have more dealerships owned by African-Americans. Bingo. We're going to get some of Ford's market share going to get some a GMC market's going to get out of a crisis

market. And Toyota's market share in the African-American community. And that's what happens every time they get one of these settlements. They get more money but don't become consumers and they spend more money just because they can skim a Hama's last column by I can prove that I can never win back that loyalty. For example there are people that will never go back to Texaco will never eat had and I don't actually spend that I don't. I know a lot of people are not itching to eat at Denny's. Well we do have to mention at least a couple of other issues quickly and that is the number of gay black men in the Washington area who have apparently been murdered in the course of the past several months six of them so far. All of these cases are unsolved. All gay black men who went to nightclubs and so the gay community the black community is pressing the police department to investigate these. Any comments at all. I mean it seems like a stalking almost like a serial kind of case

and it really does deserve some attention from law enforcement and perhaps law enforcement has the ambivalence of you know in the same way that the Marines at the Marine Corps bases were beating up people in the gay clubs in an Eastern Market in Washington. They may have an ambivalence and they need to get it. They really need to get over that. And then the gentleman in Prince George's County maybe I shouldn't call him a gentleman. People would feel insulted that this guy who kidnapped a car with three children in it was released only a short while before for the same offense without having served really one third of the offense. He was a violent is a violent criminal and the P.G. County Police say the biology of violent criminals especially those who prey on children belong in jail. And sometimes I wonder Do violent criminals get off quicker when they are returned to the African-American community. And indeed that is where this man preyed on in the last crime that he committed. And I guess we'll just have to follow that to see what happens we've got to take a short break. Stay with us.

We'll be right back. I never know what goes. Out. There's a whole lot more to talk about but we've talked ourselves out of time. Our thanks to our

panelists for joining us. But most of all our thanks to you for watching. Good Night.