At Howard; Dr. Sandra Shannon (August Wilson "Fences")

Better. Fences as you know is August Wilson's 1950s play. What Wilson does in fences. Is to debunk the myth of the lazy. Black man. I think what is most enlightening at the end of a discussion of the play is that things are that Troy is not as disgusting as it might initially appear. You know we get all that out in the open oh how dare he you know how what the nerve of this to me. I allow students to talk about what they feel to say what they feel first. You know get it all out in the open and talk about it. And that way they can get to the work. This edition of that Howard highlights the scholarship of Professor Sandras Shannon of the Howard University Department of English. Dr. Shannon took time out of her busy

schedule to discuss her new book August Wilson's fences a reference guide with an audience at the Howard University Bookstore Vinces is a Pulitzer Prize winning novel by acclaimed author August Wilson Shannon's reference guide provides an in-depth scholarly examination of the plenty including Wilson's use of metaphors in the development of a compelling relationship between a father and a son. There's something about fence's that is like Lorraine Hansberry is Raisin In The Sun both universal and particular August Wilson has succeeded in writing about the universal by focusing on the particular lives of this black family in the 1950s and he succeeds at that. Somebody was asking me before earlier what was it that drew my attention to this book. I mean why this why August Wilson. It was because I read fences. I picked up fences just browsing you

know just saw a copy of fences and I picked it up and read it. And it's interesting that I saw bits and pieces of my life being talked about in that play there. Dr. Shannon followed up her book signing and discussion at the bookstore with a master class lecture to current Howard University students inside the studios of W H U T television. Today I'd like to talk about Pulitzer Prize winning playwright August Wilson. Before we get to today's lesson about his Kulacz surprise winning play Fences. I want to give you some background information about the playwright. Fences is one of nine plays completed to date in his efforts to write 10 plays chronicling the black experience in America today. He has written plays. For example Joe Turner's Come and Gone set in 19 11. He has written Rhys most recently gem of the ocean set 1094. He has written Ma Rainey's Black bottom set in 1927. He has written a piano lesson set in 1936. He has written

seven guitars set in 1948 and of course fence's set in 1957. Two trains running 1969 jitney Nineteen seventy one and King Hedley the second 1985. But today I want to talk about fences his pillars are one of two pillars surprise prize winning plays of course. The second Pulitzer Prize winning play was the piano lesson which won the Pulitzer in nineteen ninety. Since this is not an autobiographical play and I want to make that statement as a sort of a segue into discussing the playwrights life August Wilson grew up in Pittsburgh Pennsylvania in an area known as the Hill District. He was heavily one of six children the oldest of six children the son of a German baker and an African-American mother.

According to interviews Mr. Wilson constantly lets us know that his father his father really did not have a lot to do with the family and he basically clung to his mother his mother who was an African-American. And this early relationship within the family had a lot to do with his developing a study that is he essentially eventually Kwang to the African-American culture ways of African-American culture and basically distancing himself from Europe at the core of fences. Is a turbulent relationship father son relationship at the same time. It's particular as well as Universal Father Son conflicts are both particular and universal and it's interesting how they play out in this particular play. Wilson's own step father by the name of David Bedford who married his mother after his biological father left was very instrumental in his life

and he cared very much for Wilson but of course in his own way he showed his his concern for young August Wilson rejected him. So you have that father son rith early on in that particular relationship even though Bedford tried his best to steer Auguste in the right direction. He rejected him for a number of reasons. And so the the foundation that I'm trying to put forth today is to explain how some of the things occur in fence's for example the quest for the father figure the conflict between Troy and Cory. While the play is not all autobiographical You can certainly see how Wilson draws from his own life to create the tension and the conflict in this play. Now since this interestingly was the result of an artistic mission a challenge if you will that Mr. Wilson took upon himself and that challenge had to do with sort of debunking the myth

of the lazy black man he had heard and had seen and had witnessed on a number of occasions how whites in America had this notion that black men were lazy and that bothered him. So basically he writes fences in response to that to see. Here's an example of a man who is responsible. He's flawed. Yes. But at the core of his character is responsibility. And inspiration and early inspiration for this theme of responsibility came in the form of a collage by Romar Bearden. I think we mentioned earlier how Ramar Bearden was an inspiration to Wilson in putting together for example Joe Turner's Come and Gone as well as the piano lesson collage here is title continuities and if you know what it shows here is the picture of a family we might assume is a family a father a wife the father is holding a child. You see in the background a mule a horse and also it's a very agrarian kind of farm

like setting. And he looked at this collage and saw responsibility that this man although he was a hardworking man obviously not a wealthy man certainly knew his place in that family as a father and us as a supporter. And the fact that the father is there speaks volumes also. So in addition to an artistic mission which is at the base of fences there is also a professional mission prior to fences. Wilson had written more Rainey's Black Bottom. How many of you are familiar with that play more Rainey's Black Bottom and one of the pronounced characteristics or critics critics had a problem with the fact that Maharani was not really my Rainey's Black Bottom was not really about Gertrude Pritchet more Mercede the namesake for the play. What you have here is a competition between band members and the mother of the blues and so we never really find out who is the protagonist of that play and sort of respond to criticism about you know his lack of experience or his

inability to write a play that focuses exclusively upon one character to develop one character. He writes fences in response to that. So since this is in response to first to debunk the myth of the lazy black man. And secondly on a professional level it was basically more of salvaging his reputation. He wanted it to be used to prove that he was a good playwright and that he did have capabilities of creating around dramatic character. OK the play Fences is set in 1957. 1957 as you might well know life for white Americans and life for black Americans was quite different in the 1950s. Can you give me some examples of what life was like for black men in the 1950s. Are we talking about your parents or your grandparents.

First of all let's let's let's find that out. Are we talking basically about your parents or grandparents. What generation are we talking about for you. In the 1950s grandparents always need to get that out in the open OK. So in the 1950s What do you think life was like for your grandparents. This world at Troy had to contend with yes. Forget Jim Crow laws OK segregation Jim Crow laws were prevalent. So there was a change from segregation period. And there were a lot of people here before that change that were used to Jim Crow. OK. From where. OK. So you're saying change you mean in a positive sense in a positive sense. But there was a part of an earlier era. It's terrorism. OK. OK. Thanks. Yes. My pleasure.

All right. From the time it Irvington OK even though we think about the Great Migration occurring somewhere around when early nineteen hundreds display is about the 1950s but we still see what ramifications all the great migration. So this is the landscape that the maxim family inherits. Moving from the south to the north I constantly think about Richard Wright's native son. Very similar situation. Lena Younger in Raisin in the sun this family too has relatives that have ties from in the south. They have moved up north. And what is life like for them. Terms of gender. What was life like also for black women. What was life like for black women in the 1950s. Your grandparent your grandmother's really had varied prescribe roles even when you consider

white women and African-American women you still had many roles in women roles and it hadn't been long. It wasn't until 1920 that the women got the vote. So they still had their place in the kind of in the kitchen. Right. So they were actually even below when it came to employment the men. OK. So had you heard about women's liberation. Have you heard about the feminist movement. Were those things prevalent in the 1950s. What was the tip. The lifelike for the typical black woman in the 1950s. Yes a maid or a secretary. OK she worked as a maid she had to take care of the domestic She was the house. She was the center of the house. OK what about children. What about education. What about employment. What about. What about housing. In the 1950s for black Americans again Rayson harkening back to rayson what happens at the end of that play the younger's move into a house.

OK. They move and move out of the tenement place that they were where they were residing to a house. But what was in general the housing situation like for black Americans in the 1950s segregated was very limited and was very segregated and very unfair you had a lot of I guess absentee landlords. And they were in the old tenement houses that were run down and fire hazard is definitely substandard. OK. OK. Yes. It's also very crowded around the 50s the Federal Housing Administration and also the Veterans Association a lot of the middle class white people after they came back from World War II to move out towards the suburbs. A lot of blacks even veterans were stuck in these crowded areas. Absolutely. And it's a really crowded here. OK. You mentioned veterans. What was life like for veterans. And of course we're talking post war 1 World War 2. What was life life like for them. One would expect that they would be honored that they

would be given certain privileges that that happened. OK. What was the case. Yes it was difficult for them because they still had to face the same segregation if not worse segregation. When they came back from war and they weren't able to get better job opportunities like they thought they would be able to they still had to work in factories or for public works or something like heroes abroad. They come back to the United States their home. To be treated as second class citizens. So it was also a difficult adjustment for them. At their home coming to be treated. Just like. Any other group. Very good. Very good. Now think if you will recall perhaps based on some television shows that you've seen or perhaps read or perhaps conversations that you've had with your grandparents What was life like for white Americans who you might also reference author Miller's Death of a Salesman because those offenses

and death of a Salesman are often paired together. What was life like for white Americans in the 1950s. I actually believe so when we look at Troy. We take him as an example that people. Were really skeptical. Because their experiences were as. The main character of the show was really optimistic about his chances of making. And realistically a lot of them did make it a lot of them did make it. They had the opportunities they were able to actualize many of their dreams quite in contrast and again that this whole business about the dream deferred and the deprivation of possibility which characterizes most of August Wilson's protagonist not even having the opportunity to participate in the American dream then and that is tragic. I think we've mentioned that before. Great great education situation in armed forces. Even Jim Crow

circumstances I think we in one of our classes we talked about Charles Fullers a soldier's plight. Remember we talked about how Jim Crow was prevalent even in that circumstance. That too was World War II right. That was during World War II. So all of this is sort of set the scenario. This is a scene that informs August Wilson's fences so he's speaking to that particular decade. Having said that emotional landscape fences is considered a generational play. There's a lot going on in fences it's considered a generational play because of the fact that Troy's father Cory's grandfather and lions and Ray Nil's grandfather although he has passed away he's kept alive basically how how what to the extent that he almost becomes a character. How is Troys father brought to bear or how does he figure in the conflict of this plight. Troys

father who hearkens back to the Reconstruction era. What is his role in the conflict and fences. We get a sense of where Choi's actions and where his philosophy on life and parenting and being a husband comes from. And in a play where we see Troy reflecting on his father and the story about a young Troy in the relationship with the young girl we just see where we get a history of Troy. So his father functions I believe through him through memory and also through songs. So I just think that's how he functions as a character. We get how he's lived on through Troy to see where choice coming from. Good. Yes we can understand the lack of emotion that joy and as far as when Corey was asking him did you ever like me. Because when you

found out about how his father treated him you can understand why he won't allow himself to actually love show. That's a good point and all of this is part of Wilson's strategy to challenge that myth that stereotype of the lazy black man. A lot of times people just look at a snapshot of an individual. But what Wilson is doing here is taking us back to the premise to the basis to the foundation of why Troy is the way that he is. What are some of the characteristics of this man his father. Yes. He was a share. He was a sharecropper and of course that brings with it a whole bag of emotions which means poverty which means what else sharecropping. Hard work hard work. Poverty also oppression because they never basically owned anything they were always working for somebody else and they were always in debt. It wasn't a profit making venture in fact it was just another form of slavery. OK. All right. Now moving onto other issues

relevant to this business about being a generational play. You have choice. Father's generation represented by sharecropping reconstruction the cotton pickin and the children. Basically children were sired as to be workers in the field not so much because they wanted them to love them but they wanted to increase their workforce. So children. Troy was born into a world like this. And so you see Troy of Troy's generation is a carryover from that of his fathers. And I think we mentioned earlier how each generation while at the same time you see reflections of the characteristics previous characteristics you also see slight improvements slight improvements but you also see you know the ghost or the sins of the fathers still being revisited on subsequent generations. How is that true with Troy himself moving to Troy as the second in that general second male figure. Scuse me in that generational play.

How do you see Troy extending or continuing some of the characteristics that originated with his father. In what way. Yeah. It conveys emotions properly because his father had a lot of children just to take care of the farm from his generation and so even those generations are slowly carrying over. Choi is unable to convey his emotions. He's replicating his father earlier this even though the times are changing where he should be able to speak to his children more openly or tell him that he loves them. Well he see and the thing is manifest in the scene where his son Cory talks about. You don't like me and Troy really doesn't have. He's like well I'll take care of you that's pretty much his answer I suppose. So that's how he manifests love and responsibility intertwined for Troy. Love is the same as responsibility. And so what happens here by presenting this as a generational play. We see how those things got mixed up. We see how those two things got mixed up responsibility and love. Now

Troy try not to be his father while at the same time can't be anything but has mixed those two things up. OK. Now next generation Cory same question How does Cory X10 characteristics that he may have learned from his father or perhaps by extension from his grandfather and improved on him. You rate five years and you realize what an wrong was I don't. Where is Troy It was just he just accepted that his father didn't love him and kept on going and let that change his life. Of course that I'm not going to make that happen I'm going to ask you why. So I don't become you because even though Troy saw his father and saw what he was he still didn't he didn't see that by not saying anything. He became his father. And Cory recognized I didn't know about it.

And Cory also challenges not just verbally but also what physically challenges his father. So you see moving from one generation to the next it seems to be getting a little better doesn't it. And then beyond Corey there is who who is it perhaps right now. Do you see maybe right now might be even a further extension of the maxim family. So to the credit of Mr. Wilson what he has done here is to do a kind of a causal chain here all for the purpose I think of debunking that myth because a lot of times people just look at individuals and divorce them outside of the context of their culture and also their ancestors. I think what Wilson does here is to line Lundy's fathers and sons and daughters and their fathers up here generationally and he's basically telling a story that debunks that stereotype. OK. Now another question which comes to mind in reference to fences and it's tragic nature

its tragic nature which leads us to go back and try to think about that term tragedy again originally defined and prescribed by Aristotle of course in poetics. What is tragedy. And of course my ultimate question to you is is fence is a tragedy and by what standards but what is the Aristotelian definition of tragedy. What are some of the characteristics of tragedy. In order for a play to be tragic it must have what our tragic hero OK and the characteristics of that tragic hero of noble birth and what else. Flo. OK OK. OK. Any anything else now so far have we described Troy perhaps with what you know maybe not the noble birth but certainly what. What did you say George. He has an inherent flaw. We can talk about we can identify that inherent flaw. So we really

don't have a foolproof definition of tragedy to apply to fences but still arguably it is tragedy. Which brings us to the need to reconfigure to revise the notions of what constitutes a tragedy. Arthur Miller upon writing death of a salesman had that same sort of conundrum that same sort of issue. And so to address that the fact that we don't have in the 21st century we don't write about kings and queens we write about average people. So what he tries to do is to justify dismissing or making obsolete Aristotle's notions of tragedy and coming up with his own definition and an essay called tragedy and the common man he reconfigures that definition Miller upon writing death of a Salesman felt the need to justify his protagonist being a tragic hero. But he also realized that in order to do that he had to go back and

renegotiate the definition of tragedy that Aristotle had laid before us. And so he does that that's the premise of the essay tragedy and the common man which also allows us to look at Troy in a similar way. Troy maxim garbage man in a similar way. Willy Loman of course I think was a shoe salesman. I think we agree on that. That he was a shoe salesman. But I think at any rate his his his profession on the scheme of things was not that of what the elite. OK. So I think Miller and Arthur Miller's Willy Loman and August Wilson's Troy maxim are alike in at least that way that they have common professions and that there are basically common men or just average men. They are not nobility. So using that as a basis for consideration of Troy. You define tragedy as it's a genre which requires a person of noble birth

who through some fault unbeknownst to him or her it leads to their own demise. So let's consider Troy for example using those same terms. Is Troy a tragic figure. And of course Miller's term analogous to the tragic hero is what the anti hero AT&T H.E. are oh the anti-hero is the modern version of the Aristotelian tragic hero. So let us consider Troy is an anti-hero that he has all the characteristics of a tragic hero with the exception of what noble birth. Troy was born of whom sharecropper his father was a sharecropper. His mother obviously a domestic who just left the scene because her husband was so mean. But those are his circumstances. He certainly was not born into royalty. Choi is a tragic figure. Can we press further with that application of a tragic hero.

Yes I would say so. It really is so work with rainbow it's going to target did because this is not the way it was structured here. OK. OK. In terms in terms of stature as I just mentioned Troy is not of noble birth but the task for the playwright Miller and Wilson and all others who have tragic plays in this century. Their task is to make us care about the hero. OK. Whereas you really didn't have to do that much in Shakespearean time. I'm a king because I'm a king and you should care. You know you read this. I am all that. But. Currently the tragic heroic figure of the playwright has to work to earn the sympathy the empathy and the compassion of the audience. Does he do that with Troy. Does he do that with Willy Loman. So the substitute not substitute but to

circumvent that whole business about Noble births what he took what they try to do is to create round characters that is fully developed three dimensional characters who we care about we may not agree with everything that they do but we care about them. Yes I really do think that even if he's not going of the nobility I think that that gives him a lot of characteristics that make him larger physically tough things to see good takes over any scene that isn't right. He can take over. Excellent point. Right. So I think that makes him stand out as someone even if he isn't of noble birth you could see treacherous trying to give him strength to give them anything that might be understandable. Good point. Excellent point. So in addition to creating a three dimensional character whom we care about he does so by creating a larger than life protagonist. And he does and he does that through his speech.

Troy doesn't talk like the average person on the street. Everything he says is flowery rhetorical sort of heightened to a poetic degree. That's a good point and all of that is to sort of not compensate for but to create his own version analogous to the Shakespearean tragic hero tragic figure in what other ways does Troy measure up to the heroic figure he has to be. No one is saying that he's the king of his home. Yes and he's the bread winner. And he just the way he interacts with the wife where he tells a come here woman and the way he speaks to her in that kind of he's very confident and arrogant kind of way. You know even though he's not born of nobility but he still has the characteristics of a person who was in charge as if a person of nobility would be seeming to be above them beyond reproach that I'm doing this because

I want to do this you know whether you like it or not this is the way it's going to be. Good good. So these are the characteristics that Wilson works with to make us to make Troy a tragic figure. OK. As a poet Wilson began his career as a writer as a poet interestingly and one of the characteristics of many characteristics of poets is what the love of what language and we're talking about poetry and one of my classes poets are also fond of symbols and images and what else metaphors metaphors. What's a metaphor. It's like separate ideas or something. OK. OK. It's a figurative symbol. Something is not like something something is something. There are a number of metaphors and fences. The most

dominant the most obvious of which is the that which is in the title of the play. Who can elaborate. Now there are a lot of different angles we can take a look at this metaphor we can analyze this metaphor in applying it to what happens in the play. Since this talk about the metaphor fences not just for the characters in the play for African-Americans also in the 1950s. Yeah well we were always either on one side of the fence or the other. It was never there were there was never a time when the fences were down and there were no fence in terms of African-American community and with Troy and the entire entire family his wife went into things built into people we and not to let some things out and choice was finding that because he didn't see he wasn't ready for. I think that also the fans kind of helped him bear his baseball theory his baseball dreams because it's like all this fence is coming up my

son. I mean I can't leave them even my dreams can't go on and he can let it go yet he wasn't ready to let anything go. She was ready for all the nonsense in their lives. And just to keep her family together and her husband and her son as a cohesive unit. But you know the fans kind of symbolize good good. We have a physical fence in the play which Troy is very reluctant to complete for reasons of his own. But at the same time as you articulate and I'm sure there are other ideas fence's is not just a physical barrier. There are other types of barriers and it's interesting that you mentioned and I think who is it Bono who talks about being able to finesse things in and fix things out and trying to explain to Troy why Rose wants that fence constructed. Yes. So we think about him here. I think he's basically said. OK. This is just the same thing.

He's a baseball player. OK. I'm glad you're raising the issue about baseball because baseball is also a metaphor the base the game of baseball is also a metaphor and it also leads me to something that we've not had an opportunity to discuss at this point the Negro League. And what Troys Troy is fenced out of major league baseball. OK. He's fenced out of major league baseball among other things of course the Negro League host who knows anything about the Negro League the Negro League was what an alternative organization which was only for white players. They made an alternative which was the Negro League for African-American players to be able to play. OK good. What the point that Wilson works

into this play is that a number any number of those members of the Negro League would outshine the majority of the major leaguers but they were deprived of a chance of doing so. So they had to play in a separate league statistics wise. They were much better than some of the well known white players in the major leagues and of course the tragedy of the play is that is you. You said that through some something that the character has no control over. The tragedy Troy's tragedy is that he was born too soon. Can anyone control when they're born. No. It just so happens when the Negro Leagues opened up their doors to African-Americans it was around when 1940s round up around the 40s. Troy was physically you know how you know physically demanding the game of baseball is what's the oldest baseball play you know

now this play. What do you think the cap off ages for for somebody who can do well at baseball. What is it 30. 40. OK. Beyond that and beyond that you know what a 50 year old baseball players. I mean who do. Well I mean they can hold the bat up and hit the ball. But I mean let's face it this is a grueling sport which requires basically a svelte body you know muscular and well toned body things that we don't normally think about when we think about what is Troys age. Fifty seven year old man. So basically because he was born too early through no fault of his own he has been essentially shut out of this. He has been deprived of a possibility. That's tragic isn't it. That's right. Not even having an opportunity to participate because you're too old. That's analogous

to not being able to participate because of your skin color because of one's skin color. It's tragic but of course African-Americans don't make the rules at this particular time. Whites make the rules that shut them out. Interesting. So we talked about fences the fence as a metaphor. Baseball Well I don't think we elaborated enough on the business about baseball being a metaphor. Troy does Troy does. Remember when Troy the scene where Troy is telling his wife of 18 years. Not only that he has had an affair but he he is going to be somebody's daddy. Troy uses the game of baseball. How does he use it. You think at that particular point he would well I don't know how he might be but certainly the game of baseball would be the last thing I would think that he would reference but he does. He says this when he was still in second base. Remember when this

relationship started it was like him stealing second base taking a chance in life. How many of you know that stealing second base is like is taking a risk rather than to be safe stay there and wait for the ball a safe ball. You're going to you know play that game of going between bases. Troy uses that. He uses the game of baseball to explain his himself his position in life. Interestingly he's explaining this to his wife in addition to the game of baseball. Death is another metaphor capitalized death. If you notice in the play it's capitalized. Why. Why is death capitalized in the play. Yes. Speak as if it. Hurts human being. OK. He personifies death. Why. Knowing Troy as we do why is it necessary to make death into a human being.

Why don't we what purpose does it serve. Yes. Yes he respects death probably more so than anything else. He respects death and then Troy scheme of things he has to give it. And by inviting death give death a body and then engage it. If you have your place look at what's on the cover what's on the cover what's the image on the cover. Troy is standing there. He's standing there. How does he stand there. Baseball Baseball persons What position is this worth position is this. Is he he's in a position to receive the ball. Right. And it's also a defensive position isn't it. Bring it on. I'm ready for you. He's not like

laying down saying you know don't you know like he's not he's not doing that. He's standing there ready and interestingly having read the play he's not actually waiting for a ball. Is he is he waiting for a ball metaphorically speaking. What is he waiting for. He's waiting for death. Troy is not a victim and this is the sad part about it because circumstances certainly give him enough reason to be regarded as such. And this is what makes him such a heroic character that in the face of all that he's been through he reconstructs himself so as not to be a victim. Born too early. Born black born male in the 1950s he recreates himself and creates a world wherein he is at the very center of it. Rose is his wife Correa's his son Lyonnesse his son Reveles his daughter. It's all about

Troy. Selfish yes but look at the whole picture. Why is this man this way. This is how he's dealing with the tragedy of being deprived of possibility. So he has to recreate himself. I mean sure he goes outside of this marriage. He impregnated this woman he has another child and has the gall to bring that child back home to his wife to raise. But in Troy's world he has his own rules. He's created rules of his own where such an action is not to be regarded as repulsive which strikes us as in the 21st century. Right. But if you think about Troy if you focus upon the world the ground on which he stands as a black male in the 1950s not a lazy black man a responsible black man who under any other circumstances would have exceeded any other white person opportunities that any other white person would have had at that particular time.

And it sort of leads you to think about what all other oppressed black people could have done and even relevant today because of the ceiling because of that invisible perhaps not so invisible ceiling that society has placed on them. What if what if what if it leads you to ask that question. So we talked about yes regarding him being a victim when I think about that I think that sometimes I would I would have to disagree with you because most victims use that as their excuse to play by their own rules. Well I'm a victim so because this happened to me so I can not have to do what I'm supposed to do because of all these other things that have happened. I mean it seems like that Troy makes up a lot of his own rules because of that. But I was born too soon. Well I'm black so I can't do this. But he doesn't say now he does say it but through his actions. This is my excuse. I know that I was wrong that I went out and cheated on my wife but because all of these things happen it's OK for me to do that

and you should accept that without even as much as an apology. Like well I'm sorry. Yes I'm taking responsibility for it. He just knows like you're not a fan of Troy. Well yes I think but I understand what you're saying. But but at the same time. Another reaction another other response to the world that he's in is to lose his mind that he doesn't do. He rambles in on a lot of the plays when oppression and all these things come down on people. The only way out is to lose your mind kill somebody you know rant and rave. He doesn't do that. He doesn't do that. Instead he repackages himself and I still contend that he's struggling with that label victim. Although your explanation. I mean I accept that but I still think that the reason why he repackages himself is because he does not want to be regarded as somebody who is lost in the conversations where they talk about who is that Josh Gibson

or some other baseball greats at that particular time Jackie Robinson Satchel Paige. How does he react to that. He could act and he could react in another way. Oh. I wish I had a chance. Man I think just what does he do. What does he say Oh hey nobody What does he say. All they know but I could I could do just as well as. He never really says oh actor's life has just kicked me in the butt. He doesn't say that. He always comes back on the defensive on the defensive. Life kicks him in the butt. This is how he reacts. This is how reacts this is a metaphor the anti victim Wilson strategy is to flip that notion of blacks as victims which was very prevalent trend in the drug drama the 1960s. It's a trend that he's reacting to where a lot of black people were depicted as as as being kicked down by white oppressed by white

society and all they could do was you know just anti-white spew out anti-white propaganda rather than do that. Wilson flips it and makes his character stand up to that oppression. And I keep thinking about Ma Rainey's Black Bottom the same thing. You could argue the case too that she's a victim OK. Or that her band members are victims. But Wilson flips the script. She's late for the rehearsal. So she's using whatever image she's just like Troy. That's that's analogous to holding that bad up that white promoters are waiting for her to come record a song and they're going to take take it and sell it. But she says I'm come in when I want to come and when I get there I want some heat on and I want you to have me a Coke Cola. You know. And she acknowledges you know that she's being used. But at the same time in her mind she reconstructs herself and perhaps that may be some of the way some of us deal with

you know because it it's a defeatist attitude. Why wallow in it. It's a defeatist attitude. OK interesting. Thanks thanks for that point. I want to wrap up the trivia question comment George. OK. I want to wrap up our discussion today by talking about Wilson as a storyteller. He is in love with words that began early as a poet but Wilson as a storyteller how he uses telling stories how do stories function in the play telling stories folk lore. You know one thing prompts a story. Yes. Almost always remembering characters. His father lives through a story. Father's lives two stories and even with the past that right now she remembers the songs he's told about it just everything that Troy did.

Everything was kind of like he would have agreed. You know he kept everything doing it during oral tradition that made us remember everybody and their places and their roles even though they were present my father was ever present. I don't believe that a dog actually blues. Right. However we know that in Troy's world they were there. And it affected everyone else. Good good. So keeping things alive. Recording history documenting history. What else how else do stories function. Yeah I was going to find proof that African-Americans didn't have the capabilities or as whites camera to review because they weren't thinking logically that whites were. So these stories are more or less a way to pass on to your relatives. The history of your family like right now she has just her memory of her father. She may not necessarily be able to go back to a video of Troy but her memory of her father her the court heard there is that song that you were

in Troy. His memory of his father being the negative memory is you know those times he had with Father Beck. So. Good. Good. Yes. And so I think Troy's stories and therefore August Wilson uses stories as an entertainment because we've seen that some of choice stories aren't really the true story line but with his reaction from his wife and from his friends when he's telling these stories he's telling them in his own world as you said. But knowing that they're not quite the truth and also knowing that they're going to pull last from you know his audience. So I think some of his stories functioned as perhaps August Wilson's a way to relieve the audience to relieve her readers from the weight of the actual play. So I felt like the stories that Troy told

is kind of like a little break from the seriousness of his life. Right. Good choice. Also give him character and more personality so that the reader can feel compassion for him more because he's a real person rather than a make believe character or someone who is not so you know faced with reality because he is depicted as a real and actual person that lived during that time. Thank you. Yes. To piggyback off. It does make me very realistic because you think when you're in the play I have like that all we've had from the same area it makes it really solves the whole to you personally. Yes. So you say narcissistic that he's celebrating himself. Yeah but it's funny. Yes that

is funny. Anyone else. OK. Yeah I think so I think also Troy passes on a lot of information to his sons through stories. You know he may not be the best father in the world but he he's devise his own method of being a father. Case in point Corey says Daddy can we have a TV. He does not expect a long drawn out story. How does Troy respond to that. He could have said yes or no. Or he may have put some agitators in front of yes or no. But how does Troy respond to Daddy can we have a TV or Daddy why don't you love me. Short answers don't suffice. How does he respond to the TV. He uses that response to teach Cory what responsibility he likens. You know getting a team. OK what happens

if you have a hole in your roof you have $200. He says if I if I have if you have $200 What were you to buy a TV What would you do if you needed a new roof. You had a hole in the roof what would you do of course. Corey was core's response. Bad TV could care less about the roof the water come into my house. And Troy just takes that and uses that as a teaching device. Then when he says Daddy why don't you love me. How was his response. I don't have to love you see going back to that what love responsibility kind of thing. Then he launches into a story which what is what is he saying in that story. The response. That's right. I think you all have to tell you I love you. I don't want to work every day for for nothing. I'm feeling OK. Thank you so much for a wonderful discussion of August Wilson's fences give your source. I think. Art.

Offers. A kind of truce. It offers. An opportunity to bring together a cross-section of people to allow them to talk about a common theme to react to a common good. And that's true for music is true for art. It's true for literature. It's common ground. There are so many differences in generations and race. Class and things of that sort. But Art like music is universal and it brings us together we certainly need something to allow us to come together on common ground. I really resist the phrase new black arts movement. It's trendy. It sounds good. But I think what needs to be discussed is just. Where we were still. I would just say black arts and take the new off of it because there's so many things that are continuations of what started in the 1960s for example even before that. It's not something totally new. I think each generation thinks that it's inviting inventing something new

when they actually aren't. They're just improving on not just improving on but just finding new ways to advance the same information. To sort of to to mix it up and to represent it to a new audience. But basically it's the same thing I'm working on a collection of essays. Which is inspired by August Wilson's 1996 speech in Princeton called the ground on which Einstein is a very controversial speech. We talked about he began talking about the practice of colorblind casting. As a means of siphoning off funds from Black Theatre establishments. But more than that the argument was an aesthetic. Aren't you always talking about the need for a black cultural nationalism. In 2003 the US funded one that is funded. So he's arguing against funding agencies. Who are

reluctant to give funds to black leaders. But at the same time they're willing to finance mainstream theaters that perform one or two black plays during the course of their season. Any anything that you're going to spend two or three years on you have to be passionate about it. And even if you're doing it to advance your career you also have to bear in mind that it has to be something that you like because you get to spend a lot of time with it. So I would suggest that you choose something that speaks to your inner self. You know that something that allows you to explore and to grow and to learn something new rather than just doing what everybody else has done.