The out (Episode 5 of 5, part 1 of 2); Five nights in the ghetto

Adam. I thank.

You. Woo. Woo. Woo. Woo. Woo. Woo. Woo. Woo. Woo. This is my email to. This is Frank I don't know this is called Hayward and this is going to grow on me. And as an introduction to the last of the five programmes which have been on it's five minutes

and The Gamble. Might have with me three people who have served as interviewers and helped me gather material together this documentary sort of its own. Record. Direct in the granary. Carried a substantial burden of the program going to viewing and I think it's a. Very unusual one. And I guess most of the people experience has not been. On the ordinary ranges of our experiences. Frank you interview with Ross didn't you know that I did not even mention the rain thing. As in the case of. Newspaper journalists and so on are we entitled to immunity from revealing our sources. I throw them out of that. Yes but the thing that I'm anxious to get out of that. Number the people that we could interview.

Some of them were. Of the. Unusual nature of these people were hard to get out anyway. I found for example talking to people who were very much in the public eye people who was on from there on the. Social sites that I had to have some kind of special entree to their confidence grow. You want to rule number one. You're going to look. Well I found one. Well I can say certain things I think it was because here we were with sort of the right and to talk about the shortcomings of Public Health Department. And the fact that some of the problems with the public health department has now are we not practical. I mean not meeting the needs right now there was an article not too long ago or. Within the

last 30 days and. The fact that we have a lot of. Anger and a lot of well in all of our county one thousand thirty or thereabouts. So it's going to be the big service. At all. And. You need a special armed with your. Your photo people know. Except some up there and some of the answers were not. The most revealing and I think that if we had a very private conversation they would have said more things. With the exception of. The doctor and the public and people and. Who are talked to a great length about the public health service as problems. But as for example. The public health officer.

Who would not. Reveal. His name over the air. He was reluctant to state any controversial point of view even if it did not relate to the public health department because. The Public Health Department would not like you because I know that we don't really care that a. Lot of the limitations of the budget and the spectacular job too I think it was the same the controversial things especially since he did not have it. I think they have a policy. Which you only. Have to cater statements. The second part of the second answer to your question.

I'm a people. Very willing to. But. There was tension in the air. A certain definite tension that. Somehow or other I from the beginning I did not belong there. I was kind of. A stranger in the midst. And I threw a wow. It got. Relaxed. You know we were warned. Thank you with telling you something about the 20 minutes I got. A minute for that. Yeah that was a very very interesting letter. This negro woman I was talking in the ghetto. Told me. When she was mentioning many of her neighbors the people that she knew. And she was saying. So many of them she said are as bigoted against white people as white people are. Against Negroes. And I said but they're

all very friendly the people that you mentioned. She said well they know you're not a bigot. And she said ordinarily I think a negro with 20 minutes in talking. To a white person. To establish whether he is a bigot or not. And she said ordinarily you have to get the first two or three shocks people give you the first two or three. Lineis then came up in the conversation and at that point you begin to establish whether this person is real or not. Will he accept you because of the color of your skin. But he devoted his life to Evans was the. Reason. Well she was thinking in terms of I think. Two general types of life. One. Is the Liberal who comes down to the negro neighborhood and he's going to do some good for the Negro people he's going to help them out. Well this in itself

is a lie because the person doesn't come down there to relate to the negro as a person. He comes down there to get himself a few grays points to get himself into heaven. To establish himself as a do gooder. So constantly he want to do good he doesn't a lot of talk and. Understand things as human beings do understand things between each other when they talk about like and the second type that you mentioned is like the lady that she was working for she was doing what they call day work. And this lady she was working for was saying Oh I think the negroes are wonderful and they are certainly entitled to their civil rights but how about all this violence that's going on. How about all those high negro crime rate. Why don't the negroes clean up their yards why don't they do this why don't they do that. Well the term that what she was talking about was that she believed in the stereotype of the Negro not cleaning his yard and

so what is beginning with a shock when she said that you believe that the Negroes should have their rights and everything and everything preceding the but with the shock doesn't want them back to the minute. I want to get on board. Well I remember one group you know I dropped her off with one of them and sent them and I said well that's the group of those people over there. I know what they're all about. That was the last of her several hours making me look terribly tired early computers group homes that just go up and so I've got five minutes. Tell me who you were and all about it so when you read. The first of them you're going to go out there. It. Took me quite a while to get over the fear of making them kind of. And after the first couple of times I could actually go

up and talk to them and then there was the problem of finding someone who would talk. You. Remember that afternoon. I. Mean people. You know what I know about them and they wouldn't need to. Some of them wouldn't even speak to me. We can sort of shake their heads and would do this one thing. I did talk to a couple people one person in particular that really came out and said something. You remember there was another one. You. Started it very guarded. People were afraid and there was one upgrade of you as it were the example and also maybe the tape recorder like that. But I don't know how much that was in but suddenly afraid to talk and relate what you were saying

that you felt that. You were a private recorder that wasn't put in the tape recorder made it private. That I think that some of the. Best things were said of me and I was getting up to leave. And it started in a really nice conversation and things were said that were probably more interests and things that were said and this be true myself. Frank told me something again this afternoon. He said that he was going to do some interviews in the ghetto this was another project that rank is there's no engagement. And he said that in order to carry out the project he needed to be a Negro. There's a speed things up or it isn't just a gimmick and very. Often it is the whole thing that makes it possible. I remember when I was doing the first tapes and the police brutality series and I saw a group of those are the

sort of killings. Yeah. I saw a group of these real rough looking hoodlums standing in the corner and I'm telling you I was scared to get within six feet of them and I went back and got a negro woman and I claimed to her what I was trying to do and she said Well come on let's go try it. So we got in the car and we went down. It was a room and she got out of the car and immediately he started talking. She said Now look we're all having this problem together I have seen so many instances with police of abuse people. And immediately they started looking at her and they began to perk up and she said the only way we're going to stop it. We have to inform the public of what's going on. You boys are going to talk on tape and slowly but surely they melt. Whereas Had I gone up there alone I noticed that it was two hours before they felt comfortable with me continually when I'd asked them a question she would interject and explain the questions for

them and break it down for those around her. I read that and you almost need a translator don't you or the translator of value and emotion. That's right these people. It's something we. Don't feel there's any point. In telling the white world about their problems. And you point that and not someone not really. Thinking human would hear this. They didn't trust me the way I guess for a reason. There's no we don't trust and they're not going to do anything. There's no wind on it. As Mary said the planet is actually as much as it is and negroes will find some negroes who are violently prejudiced against one another. I want to use myself on one of the interviews I

took with me. And my good friend Robert Bailey while others were sent to prison. Well I understand he's going to do it you know and he was able to do the thing that I couldn't do it with people a lot and I think what we want to do is we didn't it was and I wasn't able to identify exactly but I think the black nationalist party with Rob. Were able. Mable of develop a situation and interview which told us a great deal. About what the meaning of this anger is how it turns leaps into action and

the terminology really rebel lines and it sounds like so much pain and this is another area that. Perhaps makes me think of some of this reluctance to talk because when people did open up we opened up a lot of. It was our you know loved little things and weren't going to consistently do whatever this is. So I thought it was so graphically brought out with the with the prophet the interview. She When I first talked to her I talked to a pretty 20 minute and I could tell that this wasn't somebody you just classify as a prostitute you know. Why wasn't somebody you just classify the negro very sensitive very very perceptive perceptive human being so I talked to her and then I went back and thought about it that well this is a perfect subject for interview. So I came back and founder again several days later after she would. Be interviewed on tape and her answer was a dreamy cynical listen

you're making money on this. Your. Brother in your own interest what I want you. Nothing. How much we pay me to be on the Internet. And then I I leveled with the writers that you and I both. Are going to have children growing up in this society. And we don't want our children to grow up in a society built with hate and suspicion and I said the only reason the only way. That you can prevent hate being directed toward your children. Is to allow the entire society to understand you as a person. And I think you're not just a prostitute and not just in the extremely sensitive in a live human being. And if we can understand. A little bit about the conditions in your life which you in this position perhaps it won't be so heated yet you will get your your people. And I mean even when I said that if you change that I'll be there in the morning and make a tape. Because I've been taping all night long when she got there I was hoping she wouldn't come. It's like get a night's sleep or a loner. But she was their normal girl

and she certainly tried. I don't think she tried to hold anything back that you. Know. No I can't. I have those tapes and developments and you know them. It was a good weekend. Most of the negroes I came in and there were. Probably more educated. And probably in a better position than the ones you people interviewed and I saw another kind of distrust I was in a painful distress but it was in this test just as saying. For example I remember one interview that didn't come through. And some of them do. And this woman was very adamant when I mentioned it and then the word ghetto. She was a very very disturbed by

mentioning the word Negro ghetto and she said why don't you use the word Negro community and I think she has a point. Right there with one of the more more complicated. Terminology problem there and I wonder. What were you who. We had we had to question her. So. You don't call it I would call him you know call the Chinaman or don't call the Japanese code. So that your name was we're not negroes were American and still others. You're going to be identified with a distinct sense of. A community of color.

And economic need to get her to you know. So then we would argue this is not this is not I don't know the ghettos over there and then very tellingly removing one of them. People you meet your so goals and this is. Sort of. I thought. I was doing this with a dream world you want your brother me to want. So to me the brothers were bragging. About the blown. Out of the apt room. And you know. This would be. A source of stress. Entered under the need of the. One thing that. I

observed in the work we did on this. OK it was five nights in the ghetto use the word ghetto. And we thought in terms of the ghetto being something we like to about. But it seems to me that in abolishing it. Maybe all of us came in contact with an aspect of life in the Negro community that I think we should preserve in abolishing the ghetto. And this was a tremendous feeling. Community spirit pervaded the churches. I'm going to run this program. It was. Right. There was. One great one of these people.

Going. Into their kindness and dealing with each other and the work a lot and you know that's something I've never. Seen. And churches and church attitude and everyone's. He. Participated in. And. This is something I never want to know what the song was going to the record and I thought I couldn't hold myself.

Doing something together and in a deeper level of cooperation than we can imagine it was a deeper level the mental cooperate healing together with rhythm. You were brought up by them. Your people were put off by the suggestion that they were. You have the suggestion of a limitation. Did you encounter them more than once. Well. I think that the problem to most of the negroes that I got was that. In a way they were. Actively trying to show me that they were educated but they were out's upstanding citizens. And I think that in a way. At least in some of my interviews I got they

consciously didn't give me a wrong impression. Now let me put in the right words. They try to create an impression that may not be in the true one. Well this is part of this. This was a big thing going on with me I think. And in that. Well I thought it was true it was that where you reach a certain level of education and economic security negroes will tell you the like anybody else. In the problem do the same as anyone else's. But it's one thing to bring encouraging I mean guns kill a bird. The negro is up. So you're waiting. We were making things harder on yourself and then you're turning around and blaming whitey and what is.

This again. Noble lot of people who do know. You can support not identity. In order to merge with. Another. I found something in the black nationalist movement. And I'm going to want to like about this and of course it's a reflection of the mentality of our society. That we can't consider an individual as an individual as they are and self as an individual without first considering the color of skin. When you consider yourself an individual you don't think I wear glasses. You don't first think. I was six feet tall. But there have been ridicule my color and when. You know.

You know and I think. I think about what I read here. In this respect. I came out of this. With a tremendous feeling of humility. As Rowena was. She was sitting there. At a camp 14 rally and all the white people were up in the warm and they were talking about life in the ghetto. And she wanted so badly to get up there on that stage and tell them what life in the ghetto was like if she had to get up by name was Adams but her cigarettes she was that upset. And I feel. That. The feelings that come from being ghettoized we haven't even begun. You know legit when we started the. General objective. Meaning.

I think perhaps it was but I don't think we got. Any further than perhaps just individually we don't understand. The direction it was because. These programs were mean or deal. In circles and so on. Even if he really were your world view who would win. In terms of watching. Their lives were. Grown ups normally were reluctant to tell. You but my great difficulty and maybe. This has been caring and in some of many of the statements I made before is that I had difficulty in coming in contact with Negroes and I feel patronized. And. Because I was saying yes I realize life is hard for you when you have

problems and. I certainly can feel. Feeling this way. I would have felt much more comfortable saying you know some problems and I will not say like God says This is my fault and the other hand I will not say that it's. These people as if it's something that happens in society. You can. Say can pinpoint simple causes. On the other hand I feel much more come through there while talking to the need to do some of these New York people. When I. Felt. I wasn't up to them too. And it was more of a. Personal relationship. Well I think we all had to overcome something of a preconception. When I when I started. I thought I knew what I was looking. At a pretty. Considerably. It's now I would be a lot bigger than it was when they started. But.

I did it. Is this proof from all of the over human feelings you. Have to experience. These people were telling me how they don't know but very few of them me a glimpse of what circumstance and what some terrible experience some current group. Of Black Men and since we went in here remember the jet were two real jet light without even knowing it. He said I don't worry about white people and worry about predators. I need you just as much as you need me you don't need me and don't want me it's none of my business. And then after an hour of this he began to talk about the horrible things that happened.

The white man saying hey nigger get yourself a ride when he was hitchhiking and his memory of the payment came out all of a sudden he could say that. I think if I could drop one conclusion from this sure. I think perhaps I'd have to say. That as long as we get a lot of people and as long as we do have ghettos we'll have tremendous pockets of bitterness and anger. And we'll have all the reason in the world. For street riot at the street right. Those of us who did actual impromptu street interviews so there's more than anyone else who going up to a complete stranger. And to top it all are white and black saying Tell me about yourself. Blow sold me. Tell me how it hurts in depth. And this is almost impossible. First of all to find someone who can communicate this and who will and then will to a white person and then who will

to a white person who's a stranger with a tape recorder. It's almost impossible to do. And I don't know you know what could be done. I think you're the reporter. Well. I frankly I'm not borrowing worlds bigger than what you were. Also I would help a lot. There were other interviewers going to my candidate to sort of make him her brush and. Like it was real people in the restaurant. Will. The. Two of you not for five nights in a row on the shuttle that was going back and forth you were. Your particular corner and you get a. Regular.

Free music with you no one thought of the way we had a banger and this. On this program we had a lot of around. A lot of. Desire. And certainly none of us was unwilling to sacrifice. We were in the midst of five o'clock in the morning we were out there were still taping still trying you know. And I've never worked with that I got along so well you know there was there was so much fun to work with. Well I think it was an exciting thing There were revolutions around the record. I'm going to want one of those up no matter which one. Well I think for me was a great experience. And you're myself is actually the first time that I did. Anything of this sort. I wish I actually went to the family to get my earlier.

And some of the final word apparently. And. I hope and I think. If I have the opportunity again I. Want to go for it in getting the budget right. We hope as we get. Well I think. As long as I live out here the memory of the little negro children at church. Pulling around and eating each other and exasperating the pirate leader and then all of a sudden quieting down and singing Jacob's Ladder. There are labor world and plod with the air diligently working the machine and with a lovely movement in that there are so many people you know. Well I guess the people who were listening could visualize there were some seven eight maybe the oldest one of 11 or 12 when he said. Leonard I know we're running out of it but I want to. It would be possible to extend our appreciation perhaps to people like Reverend McGraw in the New Bethel Baptist

Church and ending up arranging Reverend Shepherd and only Mr.. Rowena stout continually setting appointments. In fact she interviewed several people for me that would have been difficult for me to interview because she seemed to have a basic understanding of them or with them. Will I say thank you to them. And with everyone and the nameless people in the streets and the names people in the. Movie. That raked over the islands. None of the people that are going to them of Lebanese was interview we lost in any of that. You're going to get all of these people. And the people who gave us material that we couldn't use and there was one of them that. I would say thank you because it's stewardess. It gave us direction even we couldn't use and we knew more about what we were doing.

Well and now we can also back and listen to live five nights in the ghetto. And this one is called. The out. Batting with. Another. I have to get out without getting out of.

Whack. I was on a break. With.

Mary. While I don't feel at all defeated not a bit. I see that

as Iran will be a winner. I don't see myself as being defeated always beaten or having to look to the man to come and rescue me when I say the man I mean of course the white man of course all the pictures you see the so-called Negro Problem the hero invariably is the white man who the good white man who comes to the aid of the Negro is always some white person is the one who is going to solve the problem or my contention is that black people and the leadership of black people it is going to save America just as it was in the civil war. But again this part of history has been lied about and or distorted. But I know I know the history and I maintain that black people again if this country will be saved will be saved by black people to the leadership of black people in conjunction eventually with with white people. It is no it is not a matter of if we could find if we could win anyplace else we would be better if we can buy any place else we will be there if you want in our movement within our incomes because no one down there and down here makes baboons

and we can find our own and same to see I'm not my slave. I don't care where you see it if you go to buy at the price jumps are or is not for sale within your price bracket what you can pay me. And this makes you angry. It makes you sick. It makes you sick to know that I can sit here I have money in the bank prepare Can I go broke and I think my children I am madly from getting to get out all my life because there was just about no place else to live and then there are the areas where I wasn't together you're insulted you're made to feel inferior. I believe that the time will come in America when there will be a true equality. But I see I have to say this but I see a lot of suffering sware and I see blood shed because I don't think that the power structure along with the white working class is going to willingly just willingly after all these hundreds and hundreds of years of brainwashing white supremacy

and the brainwashing him that this is the best of all possible worlds that they are just going to voluntarily and willingly just say well we were wrong and we're going to we're going to change things and we're going to have a democratic society. Now I don't think it's going to come this way I see it as a very painful torturous violent change in our economy. But. We. Know.

I can tell it like it is and this is one reason why I have so much admiration and respect for Malcolm X. I see these people and I say up until recently I think they have done a tremendous job apart and so far as Afro-Americans concerned to make him realize who in America and this I think is one of the greatest historical

contributions are made to Africa. There's no question about it how they actually transform people. Criminals don't Addicks self-respecting individual. Probably some of them of the better. Better.

Better and better person overbilling of. Every thing you know. And it's not because they weren't willing but with. People in other parts of the earth. Very big thing at Politico. We air anything we have and material needed everything and

anything we've never been beginning with. Never. That would be even better than as somebody that they were the only women in Israel. They really were the women rather than make a

mess of it that were never going to that would be our neighbor that we are. We have no reason or another we don't take a position that we should be a place and community. But other than that I don't think that we want any community that was going about we already are living somewhere and it only costing them over with better integrating my community about how that it would be for the same amount of money in the same neighborhood where many neighbor live and make it with 100 percent banding and the bill out that would be more than any other make a back

door wouldn't wake them with a lie. Emigrate in and get out of bed. Now the other very area that I live in without leveling and running all the way down it is a good example in one of the monitors and it would be the best in the world to speak to another neighborhood another neighbor. We haven't a market in Los Angeles with any with anyone anywhere. We have a

family with all of the family but whatever else they want the big thing with a neighbor. Would it ever get any better if I had a clear set up with the writer living. There was that can afford to move out of the ghetto because of these greater advantages. I first brought up such simple things as the City Bureau of sanitation sweeping the streets twice a week outside of the ghetto. Perhaps once a month ima get a police protection.

You know if there arises an occasion for a policeman to come to the home at least you will be civilly treated. Even the supermarkets the clerks the mannerisms. Thank you. You don't necessarily find this in the ghetto because this isn't demanded of the person or other there is no complaint lodged to the manager. Need the general upkeep of the property in most instances in the ghetto. There's a tremendous degree of absentee owner ship my own home was the place where I was born in the ghetto. It's now rented. There is no member of my family there we were all moved out of the ghetto. Why. Because economically we could afford to be out of the ghetto. One of the major reasons may be that the law prohibits discrimination. There is no racial designation for

the park. This policy of Elimination of Racial this nation and the course of years prior to the passage of the law the law the law nearly burned our policy in Pakistan years later you have an out patient. I think it has to be done more in the heart of people. People were it is fun legislation this one. But until the people stashed it in their mind not necessarily in their heart. Justin just called back will do a lot better. I thrilled that Nordic girls are beginning to get their higher education because more parents are feeling the need of higher education for their children and are pressing them on.

I fill with them time that. There will be a lot of competition. For our jobs and then we will find out whether people have accepted some of this new legislation in their heart and in their mind whether the present patients were really into the groove in their lives or is in the minority groups especially with several of the circle. Orders with a number of openings from the major airlines who are anxious to hire minorities in their stores. This of course is part of our and her friend were to open the book to these drop the big burly men who boarded was a minority were the

one your example is barreling and one had has a situation. Saying we won't look in the past five years or 10 years and want opportunities in many areas that was not open for us. We have various organisations one ness and the other the president's committee on one and so I think with companies are becoming aware that they are dropping. Maybe the CO they're thinking of the man and his wealth and think and care and he can do the job and not and but what. As a matter of fact employers are calling us every day more and more hire minority workers either with

or in the field. And examples as well. I cannot get into because of these available is limited because it is new. That's where the moment when I mentioned

the memory card. Man I'm an animal but I met. Some of them that.

They are not.