Say Brother; Button Up Your Overcoat, Part Two; 1013

It all right. Good evening and welcome to say brother. Tonight's program is entitled button up your overcoat.

Part 2 It's part two because part one that aired in October was very very successful. We dealt with solar energy weather ization the fuel assistance programs that are available in Boston and fire prevention. Well we're going to do that again. We're also going to deal with another role in that we saw in October we're going to repeat that for you because that was about a solid energy home that's being built in Roxbury or rehabbed in Roxboro by Mr. Dick Pierce. And we have him on our panel with us this evening to talk about that. We're going to have phones open for you about 15 minutes from now as opposed to the normal time that comes half hour 40 minutes and we're going to let you get to our experts early in the show. And now let me introduce our guest to you this evening. First we have next to me is Mr. Allen Ackerman. He is the president of energy works which is a consulting firm assisting you with information on better heating for insulating your home and your business. Next beside Alan we have Gloria Foxx who is the executive director of the Roxbury Dorchester a PAC an agency that is responsible for a lot

of the fuel assistance programs that have been available to you this winter. Beside her we have Lieutenant Roy Berl. He is a firefighter in Boston and also belongs to a group of firemen called the Balkans. And last but not least is our solar energy expert Mr. Dick Pierce who was here with us tonight to help elaborate on the role and that you will see later and that you saw in October. Again panel Welcome to say brother I'm very happy and excited to have you all here. I mentioned to my viewers that we're going to deal with some questions that will come to you very early in the program and I have some questions for you that I would like to start off with right now. Gloria I'd like to ask you my very first question to talk about the time the time is late as the beginning of the winter. It's December. Are there any dollars left to deal with the fuel assistance programs for any of the people in the community at this point. Now is the time to come in to the nearest daypack in your neighborhood and apply for

the fuel assistance program to do so you only need to call in to the nearest daypack and ask them exactly what kinds of information you have to bring in with you. And basically that's an information in income form from either the welfare department if you're on assistance or from the Social Security office or from your employer. That just gives us an idea of the amount of income that you have. And you also need a bill a calling bill or a statement from the old company. Realistically how many dollars are left to deal with. Well I have no complete tally on the amount of money that is left. The program will be going on until June. We are hoping for other funds in the millions that will be coming in shortly. The program has just begun. So folks do have time to apply for it. OK. When you were here in October we talked about the people that came to you in the summer. You're learning from last year what they were supposed to do and you had quite a few people come in.

Do you expect for people to continue to flow into your office as regularly as as they did in the summer all the way to the rest of the winter all the way all the way through. I'm sure of that. And we're ready you know for that amount of folks. One last follow up question. Are there any agencies that are available besides Jerome that could also assist with any fuel assistance. All of the apex across the city in those 11 apex will be handling the fuel assistance program. The little city halls are also there to act as a backup for us. We'll be opening other sites as we need them throughout the communities. That will probably happen in February. But at this point you need to call into the nearest daypack if you're a person with four folks in the family. The income criteria is about eighty three hundred dollars. OK I'll get back to that shortly. OK. Alan I'd like to direct my next question to you and ask you about the ideas that you might have for viewers that are

watching that don't live in homes but live in apartments or condominiums that that were apartments that have homes that are drafty. What could you recommend to them. Well draft's are one of the easiest things to stop and one of the most cost effective things that we could be talking here about one or two situations either the tenant pays for the heat or does not. In either case reducing the air leakage is going to help. And there's no question that we should start with the windows rolled caulk available from hardware stores come zipping around loose windows basically anything any place that you feel air coming in. That's where you should put some caulk. In fact now that now that the days are cold it's a lot easier to identify where your heating bill is coming from because you can feel that along the wall. So caulk around the windows. Pay some attention to the electrical outlet plate and light switch plates on outside walls. There are big sources of ARELY kid and in general let your fingers be your guide because anywhere you can feel cold air coming coming in that's costing you

either in your rent or in your heating bill if you pay that. If you pay the heat yourself. OK. Thank you. LIEUTENANT. I'd like to talk to you about some major points about fire prevention for this cold winter. Yes. Give us some major points. Well major points is that you must be very fire conscious during this winter period or any heating season because fire has to have a place to stop. Number one you should make sure that the areas where there are heat whether it be a fireplace or down in the cellar where you have your heating system is clean and that fires the fire does not have a place to start. You have to be a little bit of a detective too to try to think very hard of where it could possibly stand. People just tend to think that it will not happen to them. But that's the time when it does when you let your guard down. You must go all through your house checking all the heating system the wiring making sure that it's not frayed and the stoves are

clean and the chimney no leakage and the chimney as it goes through the attic. We must make sure that the bricks are well cocked or pointed to. These are the things that you have to be very careful of. So there are some minor things or things that appear minor on the surface that people can do many many things. OK. Thank you very much. Mr. Pierce I'd like to talk to you about briefly about your solar home that you have in Roxbury. Fabulous home we're going to see that shortly. What kind of extensive knowledge do you have to have to really have a home and make it a solar home. You have to be an engineer. Just what knowledge you have to have. Well no not any special knowledge I guess it's a matter of of of knowing what to look for and knowing what you want what you want to do with it with a particular piece of property. It's a little difficult. A taste is different and there are certain restrictions that that govern what you can do and what you can't do and when it comes to solar there are

restrictions with existing buildings because obviously it's a rarity that you'll find a building that that that has the criteria that would have to be met for we'd see a perfect solar site you see because it would There was no there was no particular interest in the sun as a mechanism to heat buildings 70 years ago which most of the houses in the city of Boston you know are pretty low that type of age would Freman there all different architecture and different structures. So you're kind of restricted in terms of of heating a building with solar but domestic hot water heating is cost effective if you have the right orientation to the sun. OK. OK. Thank you. What we're going to do now is roll and that piece for you that we showed you in October about Mr. Pierce is home. And then we're going to do a recap of where we are right now. We'll be back in a minute.

A surprising alternative energy revolution is happening right here in the heart of rasberry dig Pierce occupation builder a contractor is converting this home located at 23 25 the top is free to solar power while the newly painted green and white exterior undoubtedly adds a note of charm to this quaint old Rothbury neighborhood. It's what's on top of Pierce's home that makes it so special. Dick an active member of the solar resource center of Roxbury explains how his home became a solar energy demonstration project. He to be able to say hey it works. Come and see it come and see it come and touch and feel and see it. And hey it works and it's practical and only in this way can people begin to think and the pain of being may receive it and begin to say hey really is that when you get into the restoration when you get into the renovation and the retrofitting that's a full thing by itself.

But people shouldn't be afraid of that either because everybody's got certain skills that they can they can go. There's nothing spectacular about what's happening here from the outside. I know that people say what you just is spectacular but. And of course I've had a lot of experience and skill and expertise in this field. So it's it's relatively simple for me. But that simplicity can be passed on to other folks. Can you really save on heating costs with solar energy. Well let's put it this way here. The big obstacle to saving or the efficiency of all of our systems or solar heating has been the storage systems. These are being worked out. But when you remember that today you know the sun is shining today. There's enough sunlight that falls on this roof and in practically every roof in America to be able to heat and cool it 10 times over on our tour through Dick's house. He described how solar energy will be used to power the building

initially will will generate with the collectors on the roof there and five more of them up there. We'll generate all the domestic all the hot water for the whole building the three apartments. OK. The heat that will generate on the roof with the warm air collectors will heat the second floor which we're sitting in now in this upper floor. We've got a wood burning fireplace up there that also will be able to emit Lord down through the central passage and disperse on this level here. Next year we'll be able to bring warm air down to the cold air return of the existing oil if I had been on that that hits this first floor now. OK. So that over the long haul I'd say within a year and a half two years we would be able to completely heat the building. We will be able to completely surface the hot water which will already have been forced and the photovoltaics will be able to run some of the appliances in the kitchen the refrigerators will use 12 of refrigerators. OK I will use

a dryer. So we'll get the warm air from the collected to dry the clothes the water will already be heated by the solar collectors. And those kinds of things some of the lighting will be generated in here too. We won't be entirely independent of the utility company but we will be able to bring it down so that it will be affordable and practical. And this is where young people come in and young people can be able to see this. And the young people are the people that are going to be able to innovate and be able to do the things that will truly make us independent. A believer in the power of youth. Dick Pierce is getting assistance from a group of young people from project more than a home weatherization training program. Group Leader Leo Fletcher spoke of their intention to learn more about solar energy. We are visiting solar energy installations. In fact we've been to three or four different solar energy systems throughout the New England area as far as in mass and up into Everest. And we've been to

a lot of things already existing solar energy projects just to take a look at and get that kind of experience and exposure. Longtime Tampa-St. resident Harold Downes a recent convert to guess he had second thoughts after observing the solar conversion process. If you had known what you know now about solar energy before you converted your home to gas heat would you have considered solar energy. Yes if I had known before I would have been watching the work that's been going on here. And at the same time making plans for my changeover. And. It came to me. After I had made plans for my place that it was almost as reasonable as. Ever optimistic about life in his new home. Here's some of his feelings for solar energy in one brief statement. It would be my

theory that. OK welcome back. That piece was really interesting and in a minute we're going to talk with Mr. pare some more about it. First let me reintroduce our guest to you. We're having some technical problems and I just want you to know who it is that you are looking at and listening to. First we have Mr. Allen Ackerman who is the president of energy works which is a farm assisting you with information on better healing in your home and insulation in your home and your business. And next we have Gloria Foxx who is the executive director of the Roxbury Dorchester a pack. Besides Gloria. Gloria we have Lieutenant Roy Barrow who is a firefighter in Boston and is also one of the Balkans and beside Lieutenant Berar is Dick Pierce who is another solar energy expert. Again we welcome you to several other. We're going to talk a little longer and then we're going to open the phone lines for you. Just a few minutes. Mr. Pierce I'd like to talk to you

about solar energy home. It was fabulous to look at and very exhilarating. Give us a progress report. How are you doing with it. Well we we've got a lot of the public closed in closed in for example in reapportion that we're working on the wood burning fireplace and the third floor. Some of the solar the rest of the solar equipment will be on job in two weeks. Let me see what else we've got here. OK we're getting ready for a tenant. Tell me you said that in February you're going to be moving in in April. You thought that would be the final point of completion. Yes. What has to happen between now and April. Well we had a we didn't know exactly what we were going to go with with the eclectus that we were going to put on the roof whether we were going to purchase them or whether we're going to build them. And as time went on we decided that we're going to purchase

the the type collect this once they're installed the storage system will comprise eutectic salt the eutectic salt storage is going to take a little time to work out. We'll have the collectors in place in the storage system to store the heat the air after it's collected run through the collector and stored. It's going to take a little while for us to perfect that and that will be that will be operable. So hey I'm smiling at you because you said you didn't have to be an energy engineer and I don't know what you're talking about. What does one have to study just briefly just to be able to deal with this. I think people are very excited about it and they want to get involved. But I don't think they know where to start. Well we're fortunate right here in the Northeast region. We're fortunate there is a lot of expertise and there's a lot of places for information to be gotten on solar. One of the first places that that one would if one was interested in stone and say well

how do I put solar equipment on my house what what has to happen. Well first of all I would want to lose anybody out there. First of all you've got to take a good look at your house and you've got to be able to determine in something that's physical there. No unless the pitch of your roof is facing south. It's difficult or unless it's a flight if it's a flat roof then you've got the option because the solar collectors can be set in so that they can be directed toward the self so that they can collect the something of a solar collector in order for it to be effective has to face itself. The reason for facing so is that the sun traverses from east to west regardless of the seasons. So that's Kirmani in in in determining whether you can put solar on your house. The second thing you have to have a knowledge of of of insulating and how you can

insulate your home properly because if you don't insulate your home properly you can think about solar because what it's it's like buying a refrigerator door because once you collect the solar and you store it and you utilize it well of course if it's escaping. And I think Mr. Ackerman can can can tell you the kinds of things that happened happened just for President heating systems to be able to to contain the heat in the building. But getting back to where one would start the Northeast solar energy center is located in Cambridge they have the library on solar and that center is funded by the federal government. And it's a satellite to the Solar Energy Research Institute that's located in Golden Colorado. Now that compiles all of the statistics and all of the National Information that's that's compiled on solar and you can get it. But a call to the north these solar energy center in 70 Memorial Drive in Cambridge they can

they can assist in some way. The state solar office we have a state solar office that's located at ten. Fremont Street 73 main street. I'm sorry and we have numerous yellow pages alone. We'll give you we'll give you Solar people who were in contact that you can contact and they're very knowledgeable but there's a vast amount of knowledge available for a homeowner if he wants to if he can think about solar. OK. So it's not as difficult as it appears. And I hope that. Some of you people that are very ambitious and what should I say bold bold enough to jump out there and try it. I think that we need to we need to start thinking about that I think it's going to be something that we have to depend upon sooner or later. We're going to open our phone lines now. Our phone number is 4 9 1 0 3 4 0. And we want you to give us a call and ask questions of Mr. Allen Ackerman. Mrs. Gloria Fox Lieutenant Roy Berl or Mr. Dick Pierce and all of

them and ask them some questions on again the points that we talked about before solar energy whether ization the fuel assistance programs that are still available and fire prevention. I'm going to talk with them until you call. OK. I'd like to go back Gloria to you for a moment to talk about the. Forms that people have to fill out and coming in and all of that. You're about to get into that with the first part of the program. Tell us some more about exactly what one has to do now that finds himself in dire need of heat. OK. Since the weather now it has turned cold. We'd like for folks to call us first. If they have any questions on what they know numbers for them. Yeah four four to five. Nine hundred if you're in the Roxbury North Dorchester area for four to five 911 rocks burning off Dorchester area. Right. And if they're in other areas is there a main number that I can call or should they call the local IPAC in their community. They should call the local Asia-Pac in their community. If they don't know where that a pack

office is then they need to call three five seven six thousand OK that's the ABC office. OK. Downtown and they'll you know direct them to the ATAC in there. OK that's three five seven six thousand eight and CD number. OK. Very good. Basically it's one form that has to be made out. OK. When they come into the office with an income statement and a bill or a statement from the oil company whichever because we do utilities as well we do lost in gas and blastin that isn't all they have to do is bring one of those statements in. And the income statement and we'll fill out the form for them if they are shut in then we have made arrangements with the little city hall managers to allow some of their senior aides to assist us in getting information back to this office from my office. OK in my area we have that hook up already and we will do it for them in the office. OK. We have a telephone call. Why don't we take our first question. Hello this is say Brother you're on the air May we have your first question please.

Hello. You're on the air. May we have your question. I hear nothing. Let us keep talking while they're trying to get them. Working. OK. Hello are you there. But we can't hear you. So let us continue. I'd like to talk to you for a moment Mr. Ackerman. Alan I'm sorry. He told me to call him out about your firm Now you said you are not only a consultant agency but you actually do the work. What are some of the minor jobs that you take care of the smaller ones. Well I'd like to divide things into three categories ok stopping air leaks in improving the efficiency of the furnace and adding adding insulation and add more or less like to keep them in that order because that order tends to be the best use of your money. In terms of simple things

stay under $100 for a while. In fact let's stay under 50. First thing I mentioned stopping air leaks. Anybody can go out get a caulking gun for a dollar 79 buy a cartons of acrylic latex Bunol or silicone caulk. Just stay away from the oil base if you will and go to work wherever you feel a draught fill it up. The second thing as far as paying attention to the furnace goes your gas company or your oil company ought to pay attention to your furnace at least once a year. And that shouldn't cost you very much an auto save fuel a lot. And then lastly good old insulation insulation has been oversold and I want to get into that area a little bit tonight. Some of it's good no question about it but I want to caution viewers that in a couple of areas tonight about places you can put too much insulation. You asked for a nice low cost project for those of you with forced hot water heating systems. Start with pipe insulation in the basement. It's available and do it yourself form at hardware stores and building supply stores. You can buy it a

little of a time just like caulk can and do it as you have the money to do it. That's tremendously effective because those pipes are very hot and you don't get to use that heat. OK. Let's take another phone call or at least let's try all this is say Brother you're on the air May we have your question please. Hello. You're on the air May we have your question. How much will it cost to get over your stroke. Did you understand the question. OK. Why don't we ask you that Mr. Pierce. Well first of all we have to talk about what type of a unit or what type of what she wants to do with. With you and when she gets it on or basically domestic hot water or heating. There is a number of there's a couple of areas we can talk about domestic hot water for heating just the hot water that you use for your domestic uses in the house.

OK. Caller are you still there. Are you still there. No. Does the calls not go on. OK. Why don't you finish. And then we'd have to talk about about heating. It's difficult to talk about solar heating for an existing residence right now. But domestic cold water can be done. And generally a domestic hot water system for an average family in a single family house is going to run with tax credits that you can achieve through federal tax credits that you did to get. And also there's a HUD incentive grant program. OK you can talk about bottom line maybe $4900 $4800 looking do. OK. But if you we have another phone call to say brother you're on the air May we have your question please. You're on the air. We have your question. I don't hear a question. So. Why don't you ask the question again. We just heard the end of it. Were quite secret. So.

That sounds like the same question. Kirk what is your question. I think we'll go to another call. I'll let them deal with that inside and we'll go to another one. OK. Now Lieutenant Burrell I'd like to talk to you for a moment. Back to fire prevention. I don't want to back to sort of slip by us as it almost did the last time because I'm very excited about that. I might have been a little lax. People make plans for any or many things they plan vacations a. Plan all kinds of things. But the thing that can take their life. You can take your life fire. Very few people plan for this. I know that they don't like to think of these things but fire can take your life. And this is something that you should be aware of and constantly looking for tragedies are every week in the newspaper tonight. There was one of them a young child was killed in a fire and that this

should make people aware. I realize that when it comes down to dollars and cents people start thinking about how much they're going to spend but fire can take your life. One of the things I'm very happy for with this new solar thing is that it eliminates one source of fire. It eliminates that furnace down in the basement and every everything that you can eliminate in fire starting is a plus. OK. This is the Christmas season and the fires seem to be very great around this period of time. All through the holiday period and not very often unfortunately it has to do with trying to trim things like this Christmas trees and all kinds of things. What would you recommend about people putting lights on Christmas trees and lights on Christmas trees. Yes you couldn't put them on there as long as they're approved by Underwriters Laboratories. That's a seal of approval. Give me just how small. Right. So as you well on there you'll know that it's fire safe. They should have the tree set in the water to keep it from drying out on

metalic trees. Do not use electrical lines because the frequency of now that's taluk you're buying ready made and the box sets the pieces you have to be very careful in the year and this time of the season because people tend to overload their circuits could go on and tell you stories about overloaded circuits and buildings. But over has them. What about people that go to sleep and feel that it's attractive to leave your lights on in the windows and on your trees while you're sleeping. Not about that. That's a no that's a no. You should not do that. You should turn them off immediately prior to going to bed. OK. OK. Thank you. Dick Pierce I'd like to go back to you for a moment. I want to talk about money when we talk about summarizing one's home. How much money does it cost really to do some minor work. Now I don't know if the picture behind you is mind work and we'll get to that in a moment but I'd like to talk to at least about the the

minor work in terms of trying to get some slight heat even if it's only to heat the water tank in your house. What kind of money are we talking about just to do something like that. Well as you mentioned when the other caller was calling here the average domestic hot water system will see three solar collectors three solar collectors and eight again on hot water tank. The instrumentation and the piping that would be necessary in the installation for the piping in a city like that and the hookup. You could it's down now to around and and these these are ballpark figures because each system or each system at each each house represents a special a special situation. And it's true that things would have to be considered in one house would not probably have to be considered another. But you can talk about about a three collector system installed for approximately anywhere between.

This is actual dollars that you would spend after your tax credits and to the incentive grants that HUD has. And of course you're not paying sales tax on any of the solar equipment or now they have legislation enacted that also there's no sales tax on your installation that you would use that. Anywhere between 14 and 18 $2000 OK for domestic hot water just to heat your hot water just heat the hot water. OK I want to now refer to the picture that's behind us behind you. There's a home there. With glass up on the top. So solar collectors and then down immediately underneath of it says distribution. And then over to the left there's a sign that says start with an auxiliary heater maybe you. And then there's a picture beside it that you can see a finished home that's similar to the one beside that maybe you can explain to us what we're looking at and exactly how much money all

that is and how much we expect it to do. Well that on the left is a is a. As a schematic on the basic principle of solar how the sun is collected. Collectors on the roof and that is a a a hot air system. OK. And what they've used there they've used. Or actually actually basically what you're talking about is that you collect the the the sun you've heated the liquid through copper tubing probably and that in those collect is OK. And that is drawn off into a storage tank which would be located in the basement and from the storage tanks as it's needed it goes through either the air finished in the warm air is distributed with fans or blown over the warm air of the hot air. OK. And then it's distributed to ductwork into the house. But that's basically what a solar system is. You collect the heat and you leave the heat Aeriel heat a liquid and then you'll disperse it and there's a few ways that this can be done

and this is the intricacies of what happens once you collect it in. And it's it's really it's really to off the top of the head to talk about about how you how solar works. There are two basic principles you either heat air or you heat a liquid. Is this heating the entire house. That's primarily precisely what costs will be going after. That's difficult to say because we have inside the house. We don't know how. Well let's talk about the house that we were able to see your house and rocks. What kind of cost is that. Now we can take it now we can talk about something more specific because we know what we're dealing with here. We've we've got the equipment in place and we've got other equipment but we don't want to take some phone calls but I just want us to get our costs from you and then we'll go back to that. OK. OK. Roughly what is it costing to change your house over to solar. We'll spend approximately $9000 in solar equipment. OK. That will be forestalled ear. It'll be the domestic hot water system for three apartments and the photovoltaics we're getting some little break on some of the photovoltaic equipment it's going that's

being put in place so we haven't mentioned that all nine thousand dollars will be able to hit the second floor of the building and will provide the domestic hot water for the whole building. OK. Well I ask you how that balances out against heating oil. In a minute. Again our telephone number is 4 9 1 0 3 4 Roe and we're looking for you to give us a call. We had some technical problems earlier with the identification of everyone but I'm told that that's back. Also with the telephones that I'm told that's back and let me try by going after my first phone call again this is say Brother you're on the air May I have your question please. Hello you're on the air may we have you question Carollo you're on the air May we have your question. Yes. May we have your question. Hello. Can you hear me. I guess you can't hear me. Hello. No. OK.

I'm going to leave Sola for a moment and go back to this winter right now. OK. Gloria I want to talk to you about that telling. We have a phone problem. I guess we sort of figured that one out on her. OK. Gloria I want to talk to you about this winter and the programs that are available. I can't stress enough the importance of people freezing now. I've had a couple of phone calls in my office and a couple of stories told to me about people trying to get help and they're having difficulty. So they're making their fire. They're fortunate enough to have fireplaces and a couple of other situations but most of them are not fortunate enough to have a fireplace. What can one do for whatever reasons they don't meet the criteria or qualifications for fuel assistance or any of those programs is there someplace that they can go. Little city halls in the area have once again unable to give some assistance to us for those folks that might not have been able to qualify for the fuel assistance

program. There has been some emergency monies available also for folks that have run out of oil as well. Most of those pockets of money have been drying up pretty quickly. However city hall downtown you need to call into the emergency hotline numbers and I don't know if you have that number and you're going to run it later on in the show. Why don't you get just to be on the safe. I'm not sure how high. I know maybe we can get it before the show is over. OK. But that's another resource that folks need to call into as well. We'd be glad to have folks call in to us to give that. You know that number. You know come up with some numbers. OK. Now what will you be telling them when they call. Where are you going to send them. Is there some you can send them. Well basically it depends on what the case is. I mean with some elderly folks we've been able to assist folks immediately with some folks that might not qualify for the fuel assistance program and that's a little bit tougher. OK. But city hall is supposed to be assisting folks no matter what the income is. This is the way of the system. Yeah. With some emergencies that will be

probably happening more and more frequently this winter. OK. Now you are going to talk about the qualifications early on. And you weren't able to maybe you can let us know exactly what those are. Now. For a family of four it's basically eighty three hundred dollars. OK if they're a senior citizen that's the maximum. That's a Macklin's coming into a whole family of four. OK. OK and that's for the fuel assistance program and for the weather ization program. It is important for people to come in and apply for both if they have not been weatherized OK and they can pick up the weather ization kit in about the same length of time that it's going to take for the application to be processed for the fuel assistance program. We're trying to speed up the mechanism as much as we can. OK. It is important for folks to do that. OK let's see if we can take another phone call now. I have to apologize for the problems. But you know sometimes that's just the way it goes. Hello this is say Brother you're on the air May we have your question please. We were wondering yes.

Ron we were wondering if the gentleman could elaborate on where to him to obtain information for a company in cramped for installing solar water heating system or solar heating system throughout the house. Good question. Thank you very much. Mr. Pierce Well there are a number of places where one can get information specifically on specific areas of solar and the woman mentioned the the domestic hot water. Now the state or HUD the state through HUD had a program which unfortunately has just ended. It was an initiative grant for domestic hot water systems specifically domestic hot water and they issued a thousand of them. HUD had these initiative grants that they rebated five to $400. Once the system was installed and it was done through the state solar office what you can do if you're interested in getting a a domestic hot water solar system installed. You can still you can call it the state solar office at

7 2 7 7 2 9 7 7 2 7 7 2 9 7. Yes. Now that's that office there is under the the mass office of energy resources. OK. And what they do they hold workshops on solar hot water installation. They hold workshops on on on greenhouses. They are quite active quite active in solar. OK. We can call on. OK. Thank you water. OK we'll get back to some of those points. I want to see if we can get some more phone calls in before we are and the program. Hello. This is say Brother you're on the air May we take your question please. Hello. Yes. May we have your question. Is there any reader ticket in store for energy. Is there anywhere that you can install it here. Yeah I think that that's what Mr. Pierce has been explaining to us through the evening and I think maybe if you just listen a little bit more maybe you'll have some more tips before the hour is over

thinker. OK maybe we'll take another question. Hello this is say brother may we have your question please. I. Have another question I like to ask one of the gentlemen. Yes go ahead. You're on the air. I'd like to ask one of the gentlemen who were talking about confronting traps in the windows. Before I install any kind of overhearing. What would be the best way to keep track of my basement and trying to pry out of your basement. OK fine. Thank you very much Mr. Ackerman looking looking at your basement let's say you're down there. I want you to look at three places and they're all on the outside wall first around the windows. You need to caulk in between the frame of the window and the wall. Secondly where the House meets the top of the basement wall that's usually a big source of air leakage and drafts and do that from the inside if you can get to it. And if you have to go outside do that and and caulk that place. That's called the cell.

The third place in a house is like my house. You have a lot of cracks in your basement wall and that that alone can be a tremendous source of draught. So look at those three areas again as I said earlier you're the best testing machine invented because you can feel where that cold air is coming in. So just grab a caulking gun. As the clacks cracks are really serious you get some Oakham or even a small bag of concrete from the hardware store and patch up wherever the air is coming in should warm the right up good hands. OK we have another question you're on say brother may we have your question please. You're on the air now. Yes. Can we have your question. Yes I'd like to know if. How would you know if you were over in Kuwait. Is there such a thing thank you for your question. You know if you're over insulating that's a tough question but let me say one thing. There is such a thing as over incident in general from the top of the house down anything unless you have electric resistance heat. Anything more than about

that much of insulation in your attic is about where you ought to put your money. You go beyond that and you really get into the area of diminishing returns. If you have electric resistance heat maybe a little more is appropriate. So if we're talking about our 30 without electric resistance heat and our 38 which is a foot of insulation if you have electric resistance and that is probably the single area where insulation is the most oversold it is not true. And I really want to get this across. That is not true that twice as much insulation so it's twice as much energy. It's just like the first jacket you put on when it's really cold outside warms you up a lot. And the second jacket warms you up just a little more. How can we tell when we have too much when you have too much it's too deep. That's all there is to to do in the attic it'll be too thick. Don't worry about it if you've already got too much. Well that's the way it is. So they're not as though you created a problem you just spend a little money where you shouldn't.

OK. OK. That's what I want to know if there were any adverse effects but there are none none. Let me move down through the house so you can't have too much in your walls. Walls are are quite thin and you really can't put too much in there. OK. Let's take another question go ahead. OK. This is say Brother you're on the air May we have your question please. Yes I am. I've been wondering what happened with the advertising campaign that the Energy Department did. I've never received that kit in the mail. Talking about the different steps that you could take to get curbing energy from one respond to that for me please. OK first of all let Mr.. ACKERMAN try that. You're talking about the Department of Energy at no cost low cost campaign. If you want one of those brochures and one of the little flow controllers that came with them. Look in the phone book under U.S. government and call the regional office of the Department of Energy. In addition I think the state energy office also has as a few in reserve to get your hands on that because that's a pretty valuable little pamphlet. OK. Thank you. Hello this is say Brother you're on the I mean we have your question please. Hello you're on the air. We have your question. I would like to know how

difficult to get an installment plan. And that's how long it took you to get to comedy. OK. Thank you very much. See we have a lot of young callers this evening. Well I think the song is about soul Zola energy. Ok why don't we try that. I don't know if you have enough information to go with and let me back up. Let me back up a bit. When I think there's some areas that maybe need to be clarified with the viewing audience on on heating utilizing solar. OK we talk about a forced hot water system. And we talk about solar heating. We're talking about. 5000 gallon tanks in the ground for adequate storage of this hot water. It it's not a very simple situation to retrofit. And talk about hotwater heating all of it.

It's more simplified to new construction. OK. So I'd caution people to get their hopes up about heating hot water for heating their home. If things are right in terms of like I had mentioned before the orientation of the house in the pitch of the roof and and how it's sit toward the sun you can talk about about supplementing your existing say hot air system with solar because you can heat ear to ear panels. OK. And on sunny days you can capture that hot air in that hot air can be passed through the existing duct system that you have. OK. That's not as expensive as it is of course and other means and you haven't got any storage. So there were kind of limited in the kinds of things that we can do when somebody says oh how much is it going to cost to install heating solar heating that's here again it's difficult. You may have a steam system in your home.

And what do you do then. Because it's a very expensive proposition too. To talk about manufacturing steel to solar. For me that's only gets into commercial usage. OK. So I guess we're at a point where you really have to know exactly what it is you're dealing with before you can out any exact summation of costs. Exactly. Thank you. Let's take another question. This is say Brother you're on the air May we have your question please. Hello please. I was wondering if the gentleman could recommend books that would give you some practical information on the number one how much insulation. How to figure you know how many inches of stuff like that. And so practical information on how to check out your house as far as the. Possibility of solar heating. OK. Thank you very much. Mr. Ackerman I think we'll talk with you first about talking

about how would you determine how much insulation one needs of your home. The question was about a book and I'm going to refer that gentleman to a book at the Government Printing Office. One of the best buys around at a dollar 70 it's called in the bank or up the chimney and that book's been out for a couple of years but it will show you how to take a walk around your house and see whether you've got enough and how much is enough. I think Gloria's got a book here too. Hey what do you have Services Administration also puts out a book called no more heed a self-help booklet. OK let me turn it in just pointing to the time when you're in a lot of other things. OK. OK. Is that a free book. Well we happen to have a lot of copies of this particular booklet in our office and a lot of other literature as well. And we'd be glad to send out you know a package of information. I'll get one that calls into our office. OK. Thank you very much. OK you're on say brother may we have the next question please. You're on the air.

Hello. Yes. We have the next question please. We're wondering is it a collaborative effort in binds you through a role. OK. Wondering whether or not to be a solution to our meeting or something like that. Sounds from federal funding would supplement that kind of program. Part of it. OK good question. I think I'm going to ask Gloria Fox to try to address that for us. Yes. There were several groups in the Roxbury Dorchester Mattapan and south in areas that have been getting together and talking about this very same thing. The name of the group is the Roxbury People's Alliance for a sane energy future. And what we've been doing is organizing ourselves talking and organizing the small minority oil dealers and to the point where they are now an association and have joined with the mass minority oil dealers

association and trying to organize ourselves because it is going to get to that point we're going to have to think seriously about bringing into our community oil supplies and we have to have to be prepared to do so. Collectively we have to work together as a black and Hispanic community so that we can bring that about. But I can you know give any other information on the organization in the group and when it meets and you know the kind of efforts that's going on. We've just recently had a conference in December December the 8th at the Madison Park High School and we still have information on that conference if folks want to call in and get that. And we're hoping to do some other collective kind of conferences seminars. We go out and we speak to groups as well. We talk about finding ways of doing that. Right now it's on a shoestring but where it's growing it's grown so it's something that we can definitely talk about.

At one point or another folks pitching in OK we might have to talk about a co-operative fuel bank with folks in the community collectively put in X amount of dollars and bring in the kind of supply that we're going to need. It's getting to them. OK. Thank you. We have a lot of difficulty with the top part of the program and trying to receive your telephone call so what we have been able to put together for you as a land that has resource centers on it you can call those numbers for direct information about direct services. And we're going to take a look at that and I want you to get your pencils out so you can jot down some of those numbers of places that are in your particular community. This is for the entire greater Boston area. So pay attention and we'll be right back. So.

Do. We. OK we're back I hope you found those numbers and the resource center is very helpful to you. Now what I'd like to do is ask

Mr. Pierce to give you the telephone number of informational centers that he has nationally maybe you can do that. Yeah. One of the callers mentioned about where he might get information booklets on on sizing a system and that. Well we have a national solar heating and cooling Information Center and they're located in Rockville Maryland. And their number they have an 800 number to you like jot this down. It's 800 5 2 3 2 9 2 9. Now they offer all kinds of services in terms of of information on heating and cooling the residences and in some commercial applications. But they have a unique system called sole cost. So L C o S T and what you can do there. You can mention that if you're calling in your anyone is a lot of domestic hot water system and how they size it how they go about it whether it's what they need in etcetera. They can send you by return mail they'll send you a booklet that you will fill out and send in certain information pertaining to your particular home

and you can send that back in to them and they will send that back to you and it'll give you some facts and figures and cost analysis of of what it's going to take to do it in your free service by the federal government. And that's a very important number. OK. Let let me go over that number again that number and I don't call this number. Now to reach us I'll give you another number but that number that Mr. Pierce is talking about for national information on solar energy is 800 5 2 3 2 9 2 9 to reach say Brother this evening Friday evening you should call 4 9 1 0 3 4 0. And again remember this is only for Friday night not for Saturday and Sunday repeat sort of late in the program to say that but I still want to remind you all I'm thinking about it not Saturday and Sunday night. OK. We have another phone call and I'd like to address that. We have a few minutes left. And let's see how many questions we can get in. Hello this is say Brother you're on the air. May I have your question please. Hello you're on the air. Yes.

My question is directed to Mr. Ackerman. OK. I received the the Pamphlett from the U.S. Department of Energy which I found very helpful and it had that little shower head and I wanted to get a second one and I did call for us to have an event here in Boston and they said they didn't have any. Do you know any other place I might be able to get around. Well that's the government for you isn't it. All right. Very quickly a number of home improvement centers in the area are offering such devices. Almost any any place that sells insulation if you just look in your yellow pages it's likely to be carrying water conservation devices. Very simple. OK very good. Well that brings us to a close on the program and this evening is a special evening and not because of the technical problems because this is the last program that we're going to have come to you live for the first half of our season when we come back to you. Next

week we're coming back to you. Not next week but the week after that we're coming back to repeat season and that repeats season will not start on Friday but start on Thursday January 3rd and all explain that reason to you in a minute. Next week however we're going to have Webster Lewis leps the Lewiss special program that we did in 1976 and we thought it would be a special holiday treat. We want you to enjoy that over the holiday season again. Now to talk about that schedule change the schedule change. Is this say brother has now been put into a prime time slot on Thursday evening. We're very very excited about that at 8:00. Now we know that you know what we're up against so we need your support we need you to write us and call us and let us know that you're still watching us and our repeat schedule is going to start off with Eartha Kitt. And I know that most of you who saw Eartha Kitt will be very excited to look at that again and those of you who missed her will have an opportunity to catch it. We're going to run about 11 shows and then we're going to come back with new programming and that will be again on Thursday March 14th at

8:00 with black diary that was written by Evelyn and Mel Moore. Don't forget our new time slot Thursday at 8:00. Week after next. Thank you for watching say rather watch our season. Looking forward to see you again in March 9. 9