Say Brother; Community Fellows; 325

So my mother bought me about Black Friday. What was the motivation for stablish ing the community Fellows program. Well as you know Mel came over several years ago and talked to Jerry Wiesner about a variety of things and said to him among other things that you fellows ought to be helping us in terms of community development in terms of leadership development and this seemed like a very good idea. And subsequently Mel and Lloyd Rodman who was then and still is the chairman of the Department of Urban Studies and planning got together and came up with a document which has become the charter for the program. And I always take some pride in this because it seems to me here's a case where a need of the minority community is being met in

conjunction with the academic community and I would say that male had substantial input into the concept of the program as well of course in terms of the implementations and so you say a director. How did the program end up at MIT. Simply because my OK to have my TV. And one of the more interesting issues early on. Was the question of how this should be handled and I think everybody concluded that it ought to be at MIT but that there would be opportunity because in the minority community of those days one of the key issues was whether you'll get co-opted if it happens at MIT. But that's been one of the things that we've been very concerned that the needs of the minority community could get met at a place like MIT and there could be mutually

reinforcing side to it but they would need us to have an effect co-opted. But mail came here I don't know whether whether you went elsewhere or not but we decided that this was something that we wanted to do. How long has it been operating. We're in the third year now. And we it's an experimental effort and it will go on for four years and we are currently considering the question of whether and how it ought to go on beyond this experimental effort. How the fellows selected. Well by mandate Hopper we are required to take us third to one half of the fellows from the greater Boston area. And we have recruited primarily by direct mail. We've sent out some three to four thousand letters to. Elected officials the urban league executive organizational executive and then both male and I and

I think a large part of this again is male. Attending various meetings will recruit passed out literature. And I might add that we we now count on previous fellows to help us in terms of spreading the word about the program as well as telling us who are good bets. But it's interesting as to how the word of mouth is a very important element in terms of spreading the word about the program. And then after someone applies after the why. Here. Well because that's really the burden of your question. We have a admissions committee and I would say that the things that we are most concerned about a seriousness of purpose but seriousness. So if a company should come placement also. And we try to get some cluster effect for instance if we have people in education we try to get to. So we try to bring in fellows

who can complement one another. And so there is a there's sort of an individual excellence that we look for but there's a clustering effect that we also try to get in each program. We also try to get a suitable mix of male female and then census is they oriented toward minority leaders we always want to have somebody from the Spanish speaking community. And as you know this year we have our first American Indian. So the balance becomes a very important. Determinant of who wins and effect gets here and I'm pleased to say that we don't have any formal academic criteria. We've had people with as little as an eighth grade education all the way up to three years beyond the bachelors in the same class and.

I think that this is the horrific it works. It's worked out well. After a fellow is admitted to the program. What kinds of things do you offer him and in the way of tuition a stipend. Well we all offer him a stipend for her arrest type. And that is designed to make it unnecessary for that fellow to work during the course of that year. Then there is a tuition which we pay and provide a modest research budget so that the fellow can carry on the work that he needs to in order to complete his project I think we ought to say that one of the major. Requirements of the program and a key. Factor in the admissions process which. Failed to note earlier is that each fellow must state what he would like to work on during the course of the academic year that he is here.

And so this research budget that he gets is designed to allow him to travel or do other things which get the data whatever he needs to do in order to carry on that research. What are some of the projects that have been carried on by past fellows. Well they have varied all over the lot. In the first year Jackson did some very excellent work in starting a cable-TV Information Service. Cap as he called it and he worked on that understanding the technology of cable. But also working to try to provide access community access Hubie Jones was a fellow and Byron Rushing was a fellow and they worked collaboratively on campaign.

And so that one of the things they were interested in was print. Either making campaign why put position papers or coming up with a media effort. Which was designed to help the candidacy in the second year we had one fellow who was very interested in. The criminal justice system. Fellow who was interested in. The paraprofessionals and organizing. She would say the new professionals in Massachusetts are your own work which was pulling together as I would judge a variety of things which you had in motion and tying them down in a variety of artistic effort. So that there is a great latitude for the fellows to work on whatever day they wish in this year's class. One fellow

was very concerned with with economic development and concern with the fact that most of this is hit or miss and is mapped. And so one of the things that he's been working at is providing a map to to show that this effort it economic development in a ghetto community can proceed somewhat according to a theoretical input. And one person is trying very hard to come up with a financing campaign for a major national organization so that the spirit OK on the quiet a quite a gamut and I think some of these have a chance of making some difference. OK there's a seminar every every Tuesday night. What's that all about. Well the seminar this year. We called the first semester developing your point of view.

And Mel handle that almost entirely. It did have entirely what he brought to the campus a variety of points of view. In the forms of speakers who could talk about long range development. Including Pan African socialist communist. If. Somebody from se l c Kenneth Clarke who's. Talking about a more open America somebody from the Delta ministry so in the course of that semester in my judgment we provided as broad a scope. For long range political economic development including leavin the country including alliances with workers etc. As you would want to get in the spring we focus on communicating your point of view. And the emphasis here is the fellow's projects are

in the course of preparation and they are thinking about that. And so what we want to work on the techniques of communication. The fall would be more of a philosophic development of the point of spring or the rhetoric of that. And it's not quite worked out that way but but the but that's that's part of it. The other part of the seminars topper is to allow us to raise any sorts of question we wish to be amongst the fellows about their sense of community here and how they are relating to MIT what problems they are having so that it's both. In one sense a formal seminar. But it also has to do with very informal things which in fact we all know have to do with whether or not they really are going to be able to. Focus on that which they came here to do in the first.

In the mixture of what those people look like. But again we're talking about Latin America the predominant card is that you see much more Indian influence here. To keep it to the point that for instance Peru. Has preserved the Indian language. Is still spoken by the. It's a distinct line. But if you look at me you want to talk to the Indians. We need to have some kids when they were doing an exhibit on some of their art. And they have a problem. Here.

Particularly in the United States acquired. By recognizing its independence from Colombia but it really belongs to. Each country has its own and has it. But what I hope tonight to be concerned with the Dominican Republic. And I don't recall shares. What three countries share. The same time you can have it all. And. In some places you can see. To me personally visible in

public. And certain things that are still. There such as the maracas and. The second group. And the second culture. Again. This is to happen have been preserved. Better than before in places where there has been. And certainly when you look at the structure

and the. Patterns. And certainly. In the

early but again here you have to bear in mind what we're talking. It's not the 49. Hunting. Hour. That exactly. Is exactly the time but it is a very strong

one. If you look at those three islands and you look at the more recent. Influences cultural influences Chinese immigration. If you go to New York. You see the impact that the Chinese community has had on restaurants. It had. A new influx. Of Spaniards Spain that is present. The Dominican Republic. And immigration. I will

tell you. A little bit more about that later when I talk about it first. For the most part. Through their educational system. When I did my presentation as a language. And then in the field of religion. Because. I have a lot.

When you see one. Present day. And you're. In the in the flow blocking the number of the present no more than. Getting stuck in there. Ok so much for the cultural influence. After that we will share. There is a class system and differentiation. By the time Castro took power had developed a middle class system the Dominican Republic is still a two class system it

has little to do. So what I'm talking about has to be taken in the mountains. Nevertheless the class system is very strong. And. There are some sociologists feel that the class is the racist system as a determinant of people. It certainly seems to be a part the statistics are further on in the presentation when I talk about. Women and men. I'm going to present what is seen as the ideal. However the reality is. That.

There has been they are a great number of people and. The statistics which show that those numbers are misleading every year. Given that the one could arrive at the conclusion that the reason they did not marry This is marriage as a process for the upper class is something that requires money to do it to get the papers and to go through through the process and that's that. Those things have gotten more equalized than. Consentual have tended to do. Ok I'm talking about the norm. The ideal the ideal situation. And you're up to the press. The presentation of. Can. Is for a girl to raise protectively invite by her family. For her

never to have been alone. OK. In any situation so that there is no question of her virtue. That her husband be the only man that she has ever known. That it's only male the constant and that a man is looked upon as a good husband and protect. It. And even if he creates a situation by which this is possible. Right. Well I think country by country probably in the states that doesn't. I'm talking about many mistresses. I haven't gone to any of the other.

We're. Going to try to deal with that. I'm talking about. The program. The tape. That's. Talked about. A lot. But you know this is the program. And this is what's expected and.

Themselves away from culture within the culture and you. Have to. Live. Like a logical. Considered by everyone in the community in a separate category. But there is still a very strictly defined. Ideal Wife. And. And for instance the. Title of.

This. Title. The way to a man or woman. OK go to my John. Well I will tell you the front page at that time. The high tide. Comes of course by the time it took like this entire list of terms like yours and the respect words. To speak of it. But if your life life. Goes said Do you believe this could you tell me a little about what your project was when you were the fellows. My project was about the professionals in Massachusetts which

had organ but we are an organized group. We are basically so-called car professionals. I don't want to be called Pharaoh. I want to be recognized for the job we can do whether we have the degree or. To what extent did you develop that project. Well I took a chance to take a look at what was happening with what was happening and happening to them on a statewide basis and locally and try to take all that information and put it together to see what is the trend of what was happening to so-called. Professional people. In the job market in training and in educational opportunity. To what extent have you developed that project since you left the fellow.

Well it hasn't been easy for us we're funded statewide which is a big piece and this winter was just a bad winter with a gas shortage trying to bring people together across the state. But I've changed a lot of concepts and ideas because due to the fact that we were a community base we developed from community based organizations and a lot of that money is drying up in the community and we're having to broader broaden our scope of our job market is and where is our training and our educational opportunities that we've taken a political look at new professionalism. And like what bills affect new professional kinds of. Thanks Should we be supporting on a statewide basis to give us the strength that we need. We are now right at this moment talking about having a

legislative hearing around employment because we see that is one of the big. Problems new profession of how can you transfer those skills into the present job market. In what way would you like to travel to look at other new professional groups to talk to so-called professional people could you know really aware of how new professionalism is important. I think in the health field it's pointed up because the professionals really can't do the job with out the help of new professionals. And as you know we we know them is a. And with those kind of titles but they're very important assets to you

know to him. So I think we're trying to develop a collaboration with a professional. So when I was at MIT it made that I had a chance to make the professionals more aware that they must recognize and I couldn't plan for us without having us helping to make those plans. So I got a chance to like it's been a year going around just you know pounding on doors and letting people know that we would have to be recognized. Oh I'm sure it was the fellows program instrumental in any way in developing your career. You know what you're doing now versus which you were doing before you went into the program. Well. I've always been an advocate for new professionals like my last job before I what I'm doing now. And I kind of. But

but I but this are for me a larger area now to deal with the whole scope. And to be the advocate because Equal Employment Opportunity person that helps me to really see a broader base than I would have seen in my last job. OK I want to thank you. It's good seeing you again. Thank you again. What was your project when you were at the community fellow. Well I concentrate my work on on two different projects one of the projects was the whole I-95 highway fight the BTP our transportation study was going on then I spent a lot of time we're working with that as the organizations were fighting the highway. The other thing the other thing was the project around the Roxbury as an independent political entity looking at the economics so that the high revenues that would be needed whether the amount my we put in the city of Boston today would enable us to become an

independent city economically as any of that time you put in is been put to use I mean have you been able to implement it in your thinking it was a it was a tremendous you know leave valuable experience for me that the time I spent on the on the on the highway fight was personally beneficial. In terms of my ability to learn more and and girl want to stay about how the government really works you know things like that in the community. Plus we were able to win at least it when the first stage and the terms of the work are Ross Perot's independent city. I think obviously we're a long way from that. But there's a lot of information that came out from that that's been useful to me and I try to share with some other people and I hope it is useful in the coming years as black people in Boston look more and more seriously at the question of the kinds of moves we need to have to make in order to have control over our situation here in Boston area. Do you think that the community Fellows program was generally useful to you.

It was as I said it was it was it was very it was very useful I think that the value of the program is that it allows the individual to shape to use the time himself or herself. That is that each person in the year that I was there my time in different kinds of ways some people concentrate on the plants were green diamonds and the others I went around and did some research in other parts of the country and looked at that in relationship to Boston. I constrain Lama efforts here on you know my efforts here in Boston the transportation the transportation piece it was tremendously a tremendous experience for me an opportunity for me and I think for everybody in the in the program. Mike you're on the other. Feeling MIT generally resourceful. There are there are resources at MIT that if you look for them you know that they were there and were were available. Like any large institution they were going to go all the way to the lay themselves open. But again I think people who had an ideal time in terms of what kinds of things they were looking for and went looking for them

were able to get access I think that was the main the keyword there was access to a lot of material a lot of ideas a lot of people if somebody really want to make use of that access would you say that this kind of program is a kind of program that should be made more vailable to people who have the kind of experience that you have you know a situation in fact where you can go from your community develop new ideas. It's I think it's tremendously important kind of program to have a have across the country. People who are struggling point where they want get some new ideas well look back on what they've done where they need to be taking their action where other people can be moving in the future that provides an opportunity for that. The key thing about this program the thing that makes it a

worthwhile program is at least in the year that I was there I think there was a freedom there that is at the resources available. But the assumption was that you had enough integrity and the commitment and motivation that you would make use of them in a way that be productive for black people. With people saying this is what you have to do and this is how you have to do it. So I think that that aspect of it under the leadership of Frank Jones is perhaps the thing that apart from perhaps some of the models and in other educational programs around the country that our creativity our natural creativity was able to play in some of the programs into the program. I believe that whenever you try to think on questions that will have been unclear

and try to try to understand who you are and where you need to go and how you need to go in there with a lot of other people and you can see how you fit into a larger whole that you can't lose you can't lose when you're trying to wrestle with those times kind of questions and that's what the fella says they say you know you're you know here's an opportunity for black Spanish speaking people to come in and come explore where they've been individually and collectively and where they need to go. And like I said I think that that birth process you have to come out as a winner you have to grow because you get a chance to learn to think about rather than always do but I think one of things that happens is sometimes you get very mechanical and sometimes you just want to you get into things going through the motions. What the fellow does I think you get a lot of people a chance to sit back and say what these motions were going through made sense for the 1960s or may not use anyone 73 of those mechanical acts you know that we're doing now is

still relevant because things change we need to change with them so it gives you a chance to break those old patterns because old habits develop some new styles of procedures that are well like you in the community to stand back. Look for the struggle of the beer to the sun in the morning or just. What is the project that you're working on while you're here. The private eye working here and a Fellows Program is what I call a half of a chance campaign. It's a fine raise and the organization and have never been supported we've always had to depend on church foundations and a few individuals who give tax exempt money even though we appreciate that. And you know we couldn't a made it without their assistance. The problem with the cat of activity we need to carry on.

So we add to the membership which is just a one dollar per year. I'm my campaign to raise a lot of a million dollars and I propose to do that getting 50 cents out of 12 and a half. Anybody talked about it to people. Twenty people put something on paper

to do the test primarily. Back in the work we did in my home state in my home city I might be successful in other places so to get a lady the first day of the welfare rights group but I don't know a few of the first three women women in and including myself. This woman is one of the women in Los Angeles. I have a chance meeting I believe in the program.

Programs in a community that has to work when it is a rare candid place cause I don't believe in putting things but when something you have all of was at work and slowly in the Los Angeles area we also have bad news. Louisiana's moment when I tested City Tennessee and then to Georgia too which is that this will be a testing ground I have work in specifically on a campaign with a person in our office in the US. What are some of the things that you are all working on now. Program one program where as well you know we are pushing for a guaranteed adequate income for everybody not just black folks overhead a lot of people who work every day

with a family of 10 don't make thousands of dollars a year. We think they ought to be supplemented the districts where they spend all that money in the research but they never do anything about it. I'm in a program right now is selling $500 for a family of four. There are many families don't make that much in that family of 10 so that's our first priority. The other one is daycare childcare centers that is barely. We talk about work and training programs. People who need track here we don't have no no adequate Chacon facilities in this country. That's why one of the. Proud is that I mean best of my life. Then we'll work in the health field where around a happy tension about 70 percent of the women on welfare diabetics suffer from happy tension. These three things go to the diabetes hypertension leads to heart trouble

and that another one of those programs will migrate into our ongoing operation. Just look at us. Thank you. Since the program has been in operation what do you regard as being its high points. I think one of the. Best things that's happened with the program has been the opportunity for people to make some linkages. You know we've got people in the program from. Across the country. East coast west coast south central United States. And it's these kind of linkages that are going to understand the people very well over time. I think the other thing that has been for me important is the fact that people have had a chance to reflect. On the ways that they've

operated for the past several years. The chance to be able to evaluate what they've done and to weigh it in any concern or some new alternatives. I think over time is going to be very beneficial for the communities that they're going to work in. What do you see in the future for the fellows from there. Well. I think the future of the fellows program is first related to those linkages that we talked about. If the people who completed the program continue to do the kinds of things they started here. If they increase their capacity to function effectively. One other people don't want to participate in the Fellows program. People in those communities are going to encourage other people to come and participate. I think the multiplier effects of that were ultimately we have

as we have in one instance one of the current for one of the past fellows who is attempting through a foundation he's now connected with to get people from the Atlanta region involved in the program. I think that you're as good an example of the possibilities over time because this kind of program gives us a chance to convey to people what it is that is happening with this program. Beyond that the question of MIT's commitment and role is one that's still being worked through. If we are able to do this kind of an attempt to get them to see the importance of the program not only to the fellows in the communities they come to before you're my students. One of the things that we feel pretty good about is the

fact that we had Bill Wright came into something like communications and aspired several people to move into the media and communications. What I also did was it got the Department of Urban Studies and planning to be aware of the importance of communication in the planning process. And one of their graduates is doing her thesis on media and its role in planning. Could you see a growth in the fellows from the time they came into the program in the time they had completed their stay. Yeah I think they're interesting enough with some fellow I've seen some additional growth and more growth since I've been away from the program because it had a chance to really test some of the ideas that they had.

One of the things I think they come to as a result of dissipating in the program is the importance of finding a common denominator to pull together around what we have noticed. Folks come in with their individual program idea and toward the end of the Ready for working jointly or they get uptight about the fact that they came to a program and worked as individuals and did not move quick enough. Or at all in some instances to work on some joint joint projects. I think what that does is it shows that they have grown to the point where they can more clearly recognize the importance of a unified approach to things unified in terms of

that objective. They can recognize the importance of the diversity that they have within that. That's one of the things I can most impressed about in terms of the growth for other people the ability to use the resources that they've come into contact with. Many problems come and I'm very skeptical about the institution about what it is and the fact that they feel it may be attempting to rip them off. But by the end of the year they're concerned about the fact that they did not take as much advantage in some instances of the resources that we hear. But many of them really move from the point of standing aloof to maximum utilization of the resources that are

available in this community. Excellent thank you. I. First heard about the community Fellows program about three years ago when a friend of mine who had come up to Boston by the name of Tony lead who's an architect now at MIT planning instructor told me about a program that was available to people who had been working very actively in minority communities who might in fact want to study just rest but might be able to use that time to advantage of their organization or the community came up and talk to milk. We discussed several things that I might do if I in fact came to one of the community fellowships to do some work in education at the same time. Getting together because I've been making films and producing music at a range of things like that and so much of my time had been involved in just

administrating the community organization that I was involved with. In fact didn't have time to devote to that particular that particular facet of my career. The interesting thing is given that opportunity and begin to develop music fully began to recognize in fact you know was a very capable person in that area. As it turns out the committee was interviewing people. In fact one of the candidates on the basis of my experience and the capability which I developed the expertise of having as a fellow very good position that ultimately it's really as a result of having had as a community fellow.

Could you tell me something about the project that you're working on it. Well the title of the project is looking at the non Puerto Rican Hispanic population of Boston. But what I've actually been working on is the Dominican population. There are about 6000 here in Boston. But if you take say 0 2 our radius of that outside of Boston you could get get a figure about 30 to 40000. And I chose the Dominican population one because I'm Dominican and I thought it would be easier to have access to the information too because they're the second largest group the second largest immigrant in Boston that would be the Cubans would be first the Dominican second. And thirdly because if I figure that looking at that population I could make some conclusions about what a non-citizen immigrant goes through and maybe you know then have some conclusions about the Ecuadorian city

and the other Hispanic people that live in Boston. So what happened was that I ended up. Working on trying to establish a consulate because that's what the population want and need it desperately. Since right now they have to go to New York for any piece of paper or any kind of certification that that a citizen needs. And this creates quite a hardship particularly for people who work and you know cannot take a day off that sort of thing so as part of my project I documented the numbers and then have been to the Dominican Republic to talk to the sub secretary of state. And finally two weeks ago I met with the vice president. And now the agreement is that I should prepare a written document to put in the works has been committed to meeting its government that's over. But what I've I book accomplished in the year is to bring the matter to their attention and it seems to me

that they are now ready to do something about that so I'm very pleased. With It. Would you say that the community Fellows Program has definitely been an asset. Absolutely. When I joined the fellows and I think one of the reasons that I applied was because I was at Crossroads. I had just left my position as director of the Spanish alliance. And coming from that experience of setting up a community agency and. All the problems and hassles of government funding and all of that I knew that I was very exhausted. I didn't have the energy to continue doing that but I didn't know what else I was going to do. When the fellows program gave me an opportunity to get involved with my own. The project took a slightly different turn than I thought. I didn't really expect to get involved with the Dominican government but as it turned out that's what the community wanted and

that's what I did. Thank you. Frank what do you see in the future for the community Fellows program. Well we're looking at that question right now as seems to me the answer to what's going to come out of sort of a three pronged attack. The first is Is there a sufficient market. Over a period of time. And for instance one would have thought that that wouldn't be a problem at all. But this year for instance the volume of our applications was down about a half from what it was in the previous year. One must ask you know whether or not we're going to be able to get the caliber of person we want for this program over a period of time.

The second question is how does this effort fit in with the Department of Urban Studies and planning and its curriculum development and whether they feel that this effort. Makes sense and answers to what they are already doing and see themselves doing over a period of time. And that's a question obviously that members of the faculty are going to have to be involved in. For instance at the Sloan School of Management as you probably know they have concluded that it's in their self interest to work with continuing education of advanced managers from business. I hope that the faculty of urban studies and planning will conclude that it's in their self-interest it's it's a quid pro quo for them to be working with the two or leaders from the minority community because I don't believe frankly that America is going to evolve.

In a evolutionary sense and in a sense that's true to America's ideals. Unless there are in the minority communities leaders who can sense articulate their needs and help those needs to be fulfilled and part of this is seems to me is the development of a tad providing for them what this program as an opportunity to get away and work with people who've been thinking about the problem. So that it seems to me important that the department feels some of that it's in its self interest as well as in the self interest. I thought that's the sort of the second has to do with the educational aspect. The third have to do with can we find the money. We are primarily a foundation supporter. But we have indeed. And had a modest effort to get money from Boston based businesses. And. So that if we

can raise the money. The program budget is about $250000 a year. We probably could do with the last. For instance this year for the first time we have a fellow who brought her own support and I'm pleased to say from an all black town in Ohio. Came with her own business again so that we did not have to pay that but we paid for her tuition and her research expenses. But more and more we hope to get this sort of mix a mix of funding maybe from foundations maybe from. Businesses who will see it in their interest and maybe even somebody have suggested to me recently we ought to be going after some of the unions. So I would hope. But this is not determined yet that from this sort of mixed bag from some in my mit funds perhaps. Foundation funds

private sector funds from both from management as well as from labor as well as some support from the NRT community itself that this type of program. And that's what we're proceeding to try to develop and see whether it makes sense that you are years old when we all go. To be in the. Front. Of the. M.E..