The Negro in America Society; 4; (Part 2 of 2); Adelaide Hill: Early Urbanization of the Negro

There are innumerable studies depends on what you want to look at. I think they actually. It is interesting that you would have interpreted what I said as a country. You know it as being a true example to poll because it is one thing the two boys did it was to establish a sound methodology. It is one thing that that man did not do was the same. I think that the sentence in the books in between. That I would note would be no more work of ranking for Asia. Which. Has to do with the negro P began with the family. I'll use the family as a jumping off point for his analysis of the total negro society. And then he read in his later years he concern himself with special institutions a class plan the black which was they would say everybody knows that going off he did at Negro church. Raving even I didn't phrase it did I would I would commend to your attention. I think.

The Davis and Gardner Deep South which again is a study of the South. Within the framework of the anthropological technique using the same type of approach that was used in the study of the north. The whole Warner school. I would think that black metropolis. Buys into Drake and caking. It would be another book worth looking at. I think that any of the work done by Allison Davis would be another approach. When there are loads of people who have concern themselves with the Negro community and there's also a logical way of course if you looking historically at another whole group it's also about to get the fabric. But I don't think any of them has reached the heights of the boys because you just happen to be rather of a giant of a man. And he defined his problem rather specifically went

after it and came up with the conclusions. He was I might say I don't want you to think that I think it's the Bible I don't think anything in the Bible. I mean I think there's flaws with it he was kind of a pro tempore person as far as I was concerned he had value judgments on certain ways of life. He definitely favored it in that book. The kind of way of life of the into the elite of Philadelphia and looked down on in a way that would not please a blackboard today of the problems. But allowing for the fact that these were his own values which he has a right to have. The method in the general approach I think a stanza you know above all the others. I don't know that I've forgotten any of those be the big ones I think of. Yes. This is one the one that I referred to when I said freedom's birthplace Daniel was freedom's birthplace. I don't know. I I. Didn't want

to say this but I shall. I actually when I did my thesis nobody gave a damn about than it will be in Boston. It's amazing the fame I've gotten since then. You don't have. Anything. Yes. Well I. Was right when I come in on some of the positive aspects and get on living and wanted to. Some of us still prefer to live in the ghetto. I don't see why Negroes have the burden of being so different from everybody else. I think that most people like to live where they are finding things familiar to them where they institutions where their friends are all. People who

share the same aspirations or maybe the same deprivations. I think this is true and actually I am glad you mention this point because it while I was taking these presents out of the city and putting them in the country I had sighed this was a general statement but we have in closer scrutiny with certain groups have found a tendency to stay put and everybody knows that the hostility that came up in the city with renewal in the West than knows what I'm talking about that the Italians as a group rather particularly like to stay like they were they were the ones they were they were and in general do develop communities without the same degree of mobility. So I just feel that for the negro the the connotation of the ghetto has been given only a one sided approach. There's something wrong for any people to be isolated probably to make a case for that. Well it's prides crossing our South Boston. Because it isn't the true and real natural world but

all people like to have the privilege of deciding whether or not they want to be among their own and I think that it's been rather unfortunate that Negroes have. Committed themselves to be told that to be among themselves somehow is bad and I feel and I hope and I believe it to be true that they will assert the fact that I don't think it's so bad to be among their own but is it something that they say you know this is true but it isn't true just of negroes as it's true of all groups that that you do sometimes they look around nobody would you say they want to what's wrong. But they don't have the burden we have on it and I think a lot of positive things for the reasons that I've said matter of identity and looking in the mirror and not being shame. Mm hmm. The question was I had said which I really didn't quite say it that way. That the negro

living in the north found it more difficult than the negro in the south and what effect did this have on the aspirations of the negro in the schools. I didn't quite say that I mean I'm prepared to say what I said I said was that Dubois was trying to look at two sides of a case and one group said that we are free and don't talk about the South to us we don't have any problems like they have down there you know. And the other group said I mean I have the same problem but they are much more detrimental. I answer Yes I have commented on this many times. And. I don't happen to feel that people can aspire can aspire to change without models. I don't happen to feel that a boy will want to be a banker. If he doesn't see some people like him who are bankers. He doesn't have something millionaire did with the bank as an institution which he understands. And I don't think that a

boy wants to be a detective if he's never seen in his own life. When a girl detective or fireman. Or grocery store owner. And so this question of motivation which can be reinforced by education seems to me is stimulated by what one sees around oneself and the quest The plain brute fact fact of it is that in the south. For reasons that are not particularly admirable. The negro did see a wider range of kinds of people functioning in positions requiring. Competence and education. Then he saw in the law. And it's still true. You have to look a long way in New York. In Philadelphia in Boston to find negroes visible negroes in positions of real power. And visible negroes a position that children want to aspire to. Therefore I think there

is true in the north that the children didn't think this would happen of course now with communication television all the rest of the day maybe you don't have to say them in New York Museum in Chicago. You know I helped. And not only very not only the negro get the morrow. But the white person didn't have a mile I think this is came out very well and in you know I. Can clock stock after. That with all the comments that was made that were made about the board about the teachers not aspiring for students to think this is true as all hell and so on we know it but I think it's fair to say that maybe the teachers who told Johnny to be a waiter or Susie to be a nice. House girl never and there are never seeing a negro during any open. As some may have been in cities about it but I think just as many were not. So this was a product of the Northern situation in the south. People did see people didn't know there's old Datsun and so you know even if they get to come around the side door.

In whites that he was known as a functioning member of the commune there was a Negro hospital. Maybe you died there never less existed and people knew that. And this had I think an effect on the image and their aspirations. It's not going to be on fire. You're a product of Dunbar High School and a proud. Alumna right. Yeah. Right. I have for years the last four years of my life. What's your feelings about. Segregated education and the whole problem of de facto segregation. So you think I'm going to open them. I read that as a long question you know and I I I. I don't want to be misquoted. I don't mind being misunderstood. But the thing

is about it. I would say and I have said it many many times. That I do not see anything wrong with the school that happens to have black in it from top to bottom. I think it would be nice. If all of our schools all of our institutions were like. Flower gardens. But since they are not. In general it has nothing to do with the color of the people. Now it just so happens and it's one of documentation on this. That the Negro school has almost. Been universally suffered. More than just having been of one race. Dunbar I'm glad to take the opportunity to talk about it. I was a bit Khumri institution because it happened to come about. Q Your situation. You had Washington. Where the laws

are said you had had slavery a large number of negroes but there. Was never Negroes came out of the Civil War to see the Lincoln's birth place where we lived. It had appeal a magnet. Most of the negroes worked in. Some menial form of government service so there was a regularity of income at the same time there was a level on aspirations are opportunities. And so people who today Harvard would line up and say Please come and do something for so we can get more federal money or some other school would do the same thing in those days and paying attention these people so they came to this high school. And as I have said to people on the platform here I can't count the noses but I am sure that that school for a very long time. Had probably more fiber clappers and Groton fact up there and probably an equal amount of people who had traveled in that exposure because there was nowhere else for them

to go in terms of a regular job even better they had at Howard University. I got the salaries more regularly. And it was a different kind of me your and so hand that kind of cute ration with that particular town so she wouldn't be caught teaching in the high school NEMA Regrettably I should add. As they were in those days and having a system which was true in many segregated communities rather like they try here when you have different I want to call it to tracks. So that the youngster who came to that the negro youngster who came to their high school was already selected as being college your antics. The child was going to trade schools and another high school across the street and the negro of course. And I was going to go to technical school or not but I wasn't was in a business school it was another high school so the teachers had something to work with and if there's any flaws about the system it's been well documented it was the flaw that that segregated system was

too preferential to the advantaged child. The problems were with with doing that and not paying enough attention to the child might have made a good craftsman or good a good business record because it's just as much opportunity in that too. But I feel that we caught put ourselves in a box. And I've said it and written it and commented on it by merely finally finding ourselves saying that because it's all negro somehow it's wrong. I don't believe it at all. In Washington in the Washington system and this is some time where they get to the crux of the problem is to make the decisions and then the Washington system is I am told is char you had a you had an appointed Board of Education. I don't remember when it started or for a very long time there was at least one negro on that that person was not a radical that person was going to go along with the system. This is unfortunate.

Because you want to have somebody who is going to be critical of all about resources and whatnot. We Miss Broad was at that level. Then you have an assistant superintendent of schools for the Negro schools. This was also unfortunate as far as I'm concerned. I think that the sharing of the problem and the responsibilities both make the decision for education. Oh it's own children are in a system should be shit but merely the fact of the school happens to be located here or happens to be over here and all the teachers are Irish. Then see the bar this was when I sampled. All these happen to be white Oh you just happen to be Spanish All them to have Negro and the children think that in and of itself it will be a most most most re-active statement me to buy that because I think. Oh and.