Interview with Paul Tibbets

30 years ago today, nuclear power was unleashed by the United States on the Japanese city of Hiroshima. 30 years later, the effects of the bomb are seen in its victims, many of whom are appealing to the Japanese government for compensation. You can only wonder what compensation can be given to a leukemia victim or the 100,000 people wiped out in the bomb head. But despite the unbelievable power of the first atom bomb, it is nothing, of course, when compared to the modern arsenal of nuclear warheads, now dotting the surface of the earth. Obviously, any lesson to be learned from Hiroshima or Nagasaki was ignored. The bomb was dropped from a plane named Enola Gay. It carried the 10,000 pound bomb and 13 men, among them its pilot, Colonel Paul Tibbitts. Now 60 years old, Tibbitts is still involved in aviation. He lives in Columbus, Ohio, and today, the 30th year after the first nuclear attack, KUNM

News interviewed him. Tibbitt says he has no guilt about dropping the bomb and that he simply was doing his military duty. He was interviewed by KUNM's Jim Stansbury and myself Joe Monahan. To put yourself at ground zero for the next few minutes, 30 years ago, and let Colonel Paul Tibbitts explain how it was. What have you been doing since then? Since you dropped the bomb with the rest of your crew? Well, since 1945, I've had a very busy and very career, I guess you could call it that. I remained in the military service until 1966, toward the end of 1966, I had retired, but in that time period, I went to school for the benefit of the Air Force. I had all kinds of assignments in the strategic air command was going to step in Washington. And so things that you would normally expect a career military person to do.

Upon my retirement, I didn't do anything for about 90 days. I tried to go fishing and join myself, and after that, I found out a little bit too restless to be doing nothing, and the opportunity presented itself for me to join this Air Taxi Company here in Columbus, Ohio, executive aviation. And I've been with the executive forget and consequently, with airplanes which have been the biggest part of my life and the people that fly those types of machines. So today, I am here in Columbus still directing the movement of airplanes, but those airplanes now are busy carrying people instead of bombs. Mr. Tibbets, any regrets? I guess you're getting that question about today. Do you have any regrets about the atomic bomb on Hiroshima? I have been asked that question time and time again. I have been asked that question several times today, and I can only emphatically answer I have absolutely no regrets at all.

Now, those regrets or the lack of regrets in my statement about him, he has really related to 1945 and the conditions that were existing at that time. That's the only way that I can look in. Mr. Tibbets, I'm Jim Stansbury. I was wondering, as regards the current situation, do you think there should be any reparations made to the people of Hiroshima and another has been a question raised concerning damages to the victims? No, I don't see why. Has anybody going to make reparations for what happened at Pearl Harbor, but town in a few places like that? I think those were dangerous. Mr. Tibbets, what preparations did you have by the Air Force to drop the bomb? Did you have any psychological training? Did you realize the impact this was going to have on the world when you didn't go fly over there? Well, let me put it this way, I can assure you that we had no mental connection in the many particular kind at all, and did I have any idea of what would happen?

I had a vague conception of what would happen because I was working with the scientists for a period of about ten months before this took place, and they kept explaining the magnitude of the explosion, the force that would be generated by the explosion, and so in my own way, I tried to apply that to a city or to a targeted site and come up with a picture in my mind as to what would take place, so even though I didn't guess correctly because the magnitude of the thing was a little bit greater than I had vague in my mind, and I felt this was a revelation and a little bit shocking to see it as big as it really was, but no, I don't think that it caused me any great concern from that day forward to that. So, you haven't, you weren't able to see the explosion down in the Alan Magordo. Oh, no, that's because of the delay on that.

I had stayed behind my organization when they moved overseas. I had stayed back for the purpose of being a witness there, but with the weather delays and some of the things that they had couldn't stay on to watch it now. People came from Alan Magordo right straight out to Tinian Island with colored photographs and so forth as fast as they could get there after that bomb heading devoted, and they talked to me and to my crew explaining what had transpired there. I understand some of the crew members, how many were there, Mr. Tibbets? There were 13 of us on board an airplane. I understand some of them have had severe psychological problems since they dropped the bomb. Have you had any contact with your former crew? I know some of them were on some talk shows several years ago, and they seem to be having personal problems within their lives because of this. Do you know anything about that, and could you fill us in? Well, I know quite a bit, and first of all, you're working under a mistaken impression. Nobody on that crew, and I repeat, and I emphasize nobody on that crew has had any kind of emotional problems whatsoever in the 1400 people in the organization that participated

in the development of that bomb and the dropping of it. There was one man that did have an emotional problem, but he had had that emotional problem prior to the time of Hiroshima prior to the time that the war started. I was completely aware of his condition, but at the time he was flying an airplane for me in the organization. He was doing an extra job of it, and my medical people said that he was legally as sane as anybody could be declared. I saw no reason to take exception to it. Again, since the war is over, since this man has gotten into trouble and made headlines in the paper and been identified with Hiroshima, which is really wrong, I have also had contact with investigators, doctors, and so forth, who said that if he had never heard the word Hiroshima, if he had never been an uniform in the war, he would have done the same thing.

So I would just like to repeat, any kind of a comment that anybody on my crew or anybody on the crew that dropped the bomb on Nagasaki had an emotional problem, that is incorrect. There's been no emotional problems whatsoever. Not in the lane. You don't stay awake at night thinking, wow, several hundred thousand people dead because of that airplane flight. No, I guarantee you that most of my life is at that time. My routine is to drink to drink cups of coffee before I go to bed, and I can be a sleeper for my life and say the first word to me. Yeah, Mr. Tivots, there was a question raised by some of the activities that took place, the political activities during the end of the war, that in fact the move to bomb Hiroshima and Nagasaki was not in fact necessary to end the war, that it was in fact a political move against the Soviet Union, a move to threaten Mr. Stalin. Well, I certainly can't answer that, but I'll tell you from completely an independent point that I do believe that it was necessary, and I do believe that it did end the war.

And as a consequence, I believe that despite the number of lives that were lost by the Japanese, in Hiroshima and Nagasaki had there been an invasion, which I'm sure there would have been, had that invasion taken place, then I'm convinced in my own mind that not only would there have been more Japanese lives lost, but there would be an equal number or more American lives lost as a result of the invasion, so in reality I feel that life was saved. But did you talk to President Truman after you dropped the bomb? I was invited to the White House and had a very short audience with the gentleman, yes. Tell us about that, what did the President have to say to you back then? Well, he didn't have too much to say. I remember quite well that we went into the office there, we were introduced. He looked at me and I looked at him, and of course in the position that we were in, I just had their attention and said nothing, and his comment was, so you're the man that dropped the bomb, and I said, yes, sir.

And he said, ask me if I had any particular feelings about it, I said no, sir. I didn't have any feelings because I felt that it was a military assignment, and one that I had been told to do. He said, if you got them right, he said, I'm the one that told you to do it. He said you did a damn good job, and that was it. Some cold substance in the conversation. Back again to current issues. I wonder how you feel personally about the proliferation of nuclear weapons. I know that the two major superpowers, the United States and the Soviet Union, have been building huge, huge aggregates of arms lately, and they've proliferated to the extent that they're now, and many countries in the world, such as India and other so-called third world countries, how do you feel about this? Well, I just feel that everybody better be careful. Immediately after that, how were you greeted in the community? Were you a war hero then? What was the atmosphere after all of that? Obviously, because of all the published in the I got what I was treated somewhat in all. Yes, I would, I guess I could be called a war hero. As far as Columbus, 25 years later, most people around here didn't recognize me.

I've never made it a point to try to identify myself. I don't even use my military title, and I haven't since I retired. My nickname, I just like to be a fellow that is basically left alone. And does this date to you work up this morning, 30 years after, has it any significance to you? Was it on your mind thinking about it or what? Not really, no. I was not going to wait the bed last night. I wasn't thinking anymore about it, that's it. And I would any other night that I go to bed. And I was rudely awakened this morning in my head at time by a radio station calling me on the interview. Okay, your family, they didn't, they share your views, I imagine, that this was just a military operation and that it had no great implications as far as it should personally affect them. Absolutely not, there's no personal effect on it at all.

They, like myself, have gotten used to what publicity has developed on the 6th of August during that ensuing years. And we don't talk about, we don't pay attention to it. The 13 men, let's go back to them again, who are the other 12 men who are on your crew. Have you had contact with them or are you still in contact or are you friends or... Two of those men are dead, died of heart attack. I have contact with my bombardier, Tom Farrowby. We were close before the server took place and we've been together a larger part of our military service since that time. And the other fellas, we know where one another are. We exchange a letter, maybe a Christmas time or some period during the year. There's no maintenance of regular communication between us whatsoever. You mentioned earlier that you viewed this as a military operation that the president said you did a damn good job. And I'm just wondering if that's being used to not cover up, but to kind of slight the fact that this was a great human tragedy.

Do you think about that at all, about those people? It was a military operation, but yet that military operation affected thousands of millions of people, the course of the world. It's a historic action in that sense and in the sense of the many people that died in the after effects of it. Doesn't it go beyond just being a purely military maneuver in your mind? Well, not really because I won't let it. In other words, I was not responsible for the start of the war. I was not responsible for any decision made to develop the bomb. I was not responsible for electing the city of Hiroshima as a place to go. So consequently, I've taken a completely impersonal point of view. And I don't indulge in any other aspect of it. Over the years, it's just come out that way. When you were flying to Hiroshima, what was the mood on the plane? Were people talking or were you just receiving messages from the airfield or what was happening then?

No, I think the normal kind of conversation going on. Most sellers like myself had been for Blooming Business all night long. Everybody was catching cat necks as best they could so that they'd be on their toes and alert as we approach the Japanese mainland. When you dropped the bomb, did you see what you veered to the right and saw the mushroom and cloud or what? Well, we turned to the right and the idea of turning to the right was to turn to get ourselves away from the point of explosion. We had turned almost in the opposite direction when the shock wave hit us. I knew once the shock wave hit us, it was all over with. And I continued my turn right on around by making, in other words, made a complete circle and came back to Hiroshima towards the city of Hiroshima in order that we could take a look and take pictures with the handheld cameras that we had in the airplane for that purpose. Were you odd by the explosion? Did you think it was going to be that huge?

Well, obviously I was surprised by it as I said earlier. I'd been told but didn't expect but on the other hand, my imagination wasn't quite good enough to create exactly. So when I saw the actual thing, sure I was surprised. Did you ever get a person look at ground zero after the explosion? Did you ever go to Hiroshima yourself? I never did. No, I went to Nagasaki but never got to Hiroshima. When you did go to Nagasaki, what did you observe there? A lot of debris. That's a very short answer but that's exactly what it was. The city would rather torn up not as much as Hiroshima because Nagasaki was in the hill and the back side of the hill were protected. Obviously by the front side of the hill. In other words, it was half the damage there that there was at Hiroshima. Overall, you haven't let the fact that you dropped this bomb personally all to your lifestyle or your feelings. What was the name of your ship? I mean of your plane.

The B-29 was a bomber that was coming off of the production line at that particular time. As a matter of fact, the B-29 were operating in the Mariana's carrying fire bomb to get to Japan when we went out there. Our airplane had to be changed internally in the Bombay just a little bit because of the type of bomb that it was, the manner in which it was suspended in the Bombay and the electrical fusion mechanism on the bomb itself required power from the airplane to keep the batteries charged up. It was the same airplane externally but internally there were a few changes made. Now you're working in Columbus Air Force Laboratories. What's your present occupation? I don't know. I'm with an Air Taxi company that flies jet airplanes and taxi service throughout the United States. Can you go for a little American, South America? Have you done any flying yourself? Sure, I fly all the time. And for the company or for your own pleasure, what?

Well, I fly normally for company business. You get a lot of phone calls, I imagine, every August 6th. No, the 25th and the 30th seem to be the biggest ones. Last year I had nobody, nobody even acknowledged that it was the 6th of August as far as I know. You've been listening to an interview with... You've been listening to an interview with Colonel Paul Tibbitts, now a retired military. You've been listening to an interview with Colonel Paul Tibbitts, the man who piloted the airplane that dropped the atomic bomb over Hiroshima in 1945. 30 years ago, today. This is Joe Monahan reporting for KUNM. Thank you.