PBS NewsHour Debates 2016: A Special Report; PBS NewsHour Debates 2016: A Special Report : KQED : October 4, 2016 7:36pm-8:01pm PDT

LAS VEGAS. FROM FARMVILLE, VIRGINIA, I'M ELAINE QUIJANO OF CBS NEWS, GOOD NIGHT. [ Applause ]

>> Ifill: THAT DOES WRAP UP THE DEBATE BETWEEN TIM KAINE AND MIKE PENCE, JOINING ME HERE IN OUR PBS NEWS OUR STUDIO ARE MARK SHIELDS, AMY WALTER OF THE "COOK POLITICAL REPORT." AND "WASHINGTON POST" COLUMNIST MICHAEL GERSON. TO ALL THREE OF YOU WE'RE GOING TO CONTINUE TO WATCH MR. PENCE, GOVERNOR PENCE AND SENATOR KAINE ON THE STAGE AS THEY GREET THEIR FAMILY. MARK SHIELDS, THIS WAS A DEBATE WITH A LOT OF ISSUE QUESTIONS. WHAT DID YOU THINK?

>> I THOUGHT THAT THE REPUBLICANS IN BOTH WEEKS IF THERE WERE SPINS OF 20 MINUTES DID WELL. UNTORT NATURAL LY 90 MINUTE MARATHONS. TIM KAINE CAME OUT CAPTIVATED. AND A LITTLE HYPER. AS IT WENT ON HE GOT STRONGER, MORE MEASURED AND PUT -- DOMINATED THE DEBATE IN TERMS OF PUTTING MIKE PENCE WHOSE TONE THROUGHOUT I THOUGHT WAS EXCELLENT. BUT PUT HIM ON DEFENSIVE, I DON'T BELIEVE YOU'LL DEFEND DONALD TRUMP AND THEN EVERYTHING HE SAID ABOUT DONALD TRUMP WAS TRUE. AND HE WAS RIGHT. MIKE PENCE DID NOT DEFEND HIM. HE MADE THE BEST CASE HE COULD. I THOUGHT PENCE MADE GOOD -- HE WAS PUT IN DEFENSIVE TRYING TO -- WHICH HE REFUSED TO DO.

>> Woodruff: AMY WALTER DID YOU SAY TIM KAINE PUTTING GOVERNOR PENCE ON THE DEFENSIVE?

>> I THINK WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO FIGURE OUT AS PEOPLE START TO DIGEST THIS, WHAT FOLKS ARE GOING TO REMEMBER MORE ABOUT THIS DEBATE. WHETHER IT WAS KAINE INTERRUPTING TO PUT HIM ON THE DEFENSIVE. WHICH IF YOU JUST JUDGED BY TWITTER AND PEOPLE SORT OF KEYING IN, THEY FOUND THAT A LITTLE OVER THE TOP. TOO MUCH TIME INTERIMMING NOT ENOUGH TIME -- INTERRUPTING NOT TOUGH TIME TALKING ABOUT THE ISSUES. IT IS TRUE, THOUGH, THAT WHILE KAINE DEFINITE LY THREW ALL OF TRUMPS PAST STATEMENTS AT PENCE HE FOUND WAY TO DUCK AND DODGE AND TRIED TO GET THE CONVERSATION BACK TO HILLARY CLINTON. BACK TO THE ISSUES HE WANTED TO TALK ABOUT. SEE THAT GO, LOOK, HE DIDN'T ACTUALLY ADDRESS THE SPECIFIC ISSUES, OR WILL THEY REMEMBER IT MORE FOR THE FACT THAT HE DIDN'T HEAR MIKE PENCE GO SORT OF DOWN A RABBIT HOLE IN THE SAME WAY THAT DONALD TRUMP DID IN THE LAST DEBATE. WHERE HE JUST DEFENDED OVER THE TOP STATEMENTS AND THEN GOT HIM SHELF IN BIGGER TROUBLE.

>> Woodruff: HOW DO YOU SEE IT?

>> SENATOR KAINE OFTEN GOT THE BEST OF THE ARGUMENTS. HE HAD THIS WIZARDRY LIKE PREPARED PROSECUTOR. LOT OF MATERIAL TO WORK WITH. TO BE HONEST. I THINK -- WITH TRUMPS PAST STATEMENTS. EVERYONE THAT LOVES TIM KAINE WHO KNOWS HIM, I'M NOT SURE IF THAT WAS ON DISPLAY TONIGHT HERE IN THE DEBATE. HE WAS SOMETIMES NOT VERY APPEALING, PARTICULARLY IN THE FIRST HALF OF THE DEBATE WHERE I THINK HE INTERRUPTED. I WOULD THINK BY POINTS YOU GO WITH KAINE THEN STYLE IT WAS OFTEN PENS.

>> Ifill: YOU'RE SAYING THAT KAINE WAS TOO MUCH ON THE ATTA ATTACK, TOO MUCH TRYING TO PIN DOWN MIKE PENCE?

>> HE THINK MAYBE TOO KIND IN THIS CASE, HE OFTEN -- SOMETIMES REMOVED. THAT I THINK IN THE DEBATE CAN COME ACROSS POORLY. SO, BUT DID HE GET BETTER OVER TIME.

>> Ifill: OUR LY SPA DEJAR DAB AS WE WATCH OUR CANDIDATES THERE ON THE STAGE. AT LONGWOOD UNIVERSITY. LISA IS SOMEWHERE BEHIND THE STAGE OR NEARBY. WHERE SHE HAS BEEN WATCHING THE DEBATE. TELL US WHAT YOU'RE SEEING AND HEARING THERE?

>> THAT'S RIGHT. NEARBY THE STAGE THROUGH NEXT -- THIS IS THE SPIN ROOM WHERE WE HEAR FROM THE CAMPAIGN IMMEDIATE AFTER THE DEBATE. FEW FEET AWAY FROM ME WHO CAME THROUGH WAS KELLYANNE CONWAY THE CAMPAIGN MANAGER, FIRST TO SPEAK WITH HER I DON'T THINK SHE SPOKE TO MANY REPORTERS. HERE IS WHAT THE TRUMP CAMPAIGN WHAT KELLYANNE SAID THIS HAS BEEN -- FELT HE KNOCKED IT OUT OF THE PARK THAT HE WAS PARTICULARLY COMMANDING ON POLICY AND ESPECIALLY WHAT SHE SAID, SHE SAID SHE FELT SHE WAS POLITE NEVER RUDE, FEELS THAT TIM KAINE WILL REGET GET THE NUMBER OF TIMES HE INTERRUPTED. ON THE OTHER HAND STANDING BEHIND ME THIS GIANT SCRUM OF REPORTERS AND MICROPHONES THEY'RE ALL IN THAT PILE OF PEOPLE TALKING TO THE CLINTON CAMPAIGN. I CAN HEAR, I'M CLOSE ENOUGH, HE'S STRESSING OTHER THINGS. HE'S STAYING THAT HE FELT TIM KAINE HAD A STRONG NIGHT ON COUPLE OF AREAS, ONE OF THEM BEING TALKING ABOUT WOMEN, TALKING ABOUT THEIR APPEAL TO WOMEN ALSO TALKING ABOUT DONALD TRUMP'S HISTORY OF GLOBAL ATTACKS ON WOMEN AND ON IMMIGRANTS. TWO VERY DIFFERENT TAKES ON THIS DEBATE TONIGHT. NOT HEARING ABOUT INTERRUPTIONS OF RUNS FROM THE KAINE CAMP BUT SOMETHING THE TRUMP FOLKS ARE GOING TO STRESS PROBABLY NOT JUST TONIGHT.

>> Woodruff: WE WELCOME BACK TO YOU A LITTLE BIT LATER AS YOU GET A CHANCE TO TALK TO SOME OF THE OTHER REPRESENTATIVES OF THE TWO CAMPAIGNS THERE. I THINK WE WANT TO GO UP TO OUR NEWSROOM RIGHT NOW, IS THAT RIGHT? OUR JOHN YANG HAS ALSO BEEN LISTENING VERY CLOSELY TO THE DEBATE WITH OUR TEAM WORKING WITH OUR TEAM FACT CHECKING WHAT WAS SAID. JOHN, WHAT DID YOU DISCOVER?

>> WELL, JUDY, WE FOUND COUPLE OF INSTANCES WHEN EACH OF THE CANDIDATES HAD A LITTLE TROUBLE WITH THE FACTS. ONE WAS TIM KAINE HE WAS PRAISING THE TICKET, HILLARY CLINTON, HE GAVE HER CREDIT FOR TOUGH NEGOTIATIONS TO ELIMINATE THE IRANIAN NUCLEAR WEAPONS PROGRAM. IN FACT, THAT AGREEMENT CAME TWO AND A HALF YEARS AFTER SECRETARY CLINTON LEFT THE ADMINISTRATION AND THAT THE AGREEMENT ITSELF SLOWS THE NUCLEAR WEAPON PROGRAM IN IRAN. DOESN'T ELIMINATE IT. MAKE PENCE GOT INTO TROUBLE TALKING ABOUT THE TOP MUCH HIS TOCCHETE DONALD TRUMP, HE CAME IN -- AGAINST ALLEGATION OR TIM KAINE SAYING THAT TRUMP HAD SAID THAT MORE NATIONS SHOULD GET NUCLEAR WEAPONS. PENCE CAME BACK HE NEVER SAID -- SAYS THAT SENATOR, YOU KNOW IT, IN FACT IN MARCH TRUMP TOLD THE "NEW YORK TIMES" THAT IT MAY NOT BE SUCH A BAD THING FOR THE UNITED STATES IF JAPAN, SOUTH KOREA AND SAUDI ARABIA HAD NUCLEAR WEAPONS. IN EACH INSTANCE THE TOP OF THE TICKET GOT THE NUMBER TWO ON THE TICKET INTO A LITTLE TROUBLE IN ONE CASE PRAISING AND IN ONE CASE DEFENDING.

>> Woodruff: THANK YOU, JOHN. WE KNOW THERE WAS A LOT THROWN AROUND IN THE DEBATE TONIGHT, LOT OF ISSUES THAT THEY COVERED BUT BEFORE WE GET TO ANY MORE OF THAT, MARK, COME BACK TO YOU ON THE POINTS THAT AMY AND MICHAEL WERE MAKING WHERE TIM KAINE MAY HAVE WON ON POINTS BUT WHEN IT COMES TO PRESENTATION, TO DEMEANOR, MAYBE HE DIDN'T. HOW DO YOU SEE THAT.

>> I USE THE WORD CAFE FATED, HE HAD -- CAFE FATED, YOUR HIRED, YOUR FIRED, PRESIDENT. APPEARED TO USE THE WORD OVERPREPARED. THERE'S NO DOUBT ABOUT IT. BUT I THINK AS IT WENT ON, THERE WAS NO QUESTION, HE WAS PROSECUTING IN A MORE AFFABLE SENSE BUT MAKING THE CASE. WHEN HE SAID GOVERNOR PENCE HAD TO GIVE DONALD TRUMP HIS TAX RETURNS IN ORDER TO BE VICE PRESIDENT, IT WAS A SUPERB POI POINT. THEN PENCE SAY, I DON'T THINK SENATOR PENCE WILL DEFEND GOVERNOR PENCE WILL DEFEND THIS HE WAS RIGHT. PENCE DID NOT SPEND HIS TIME GOING DOWN A RABBIT HOLE AS AMY PUT IT. OR DEFENDING DONALD TRUMP. I GUESS WHEN MIKE PENCE SAID, DONALD TRUMP JEWELED THE TAX CODE JUST THE WAY IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE USED BRILLIANTLY POW, BOY, I HAVE TO BE VERY FRANK SHOW US THE TAX RETURNS. HOW BRILLIANT WAS IT? AND THE POINT THAT WAS MADE THAT I THINK WILL COME OUT OF THIS DEBATE IS THE NARRATIVE. I THINK CLINTON CAMPAIGN IS MISHANDLED TRUMPS TAXES, IT SHOULD BE BUT HE SAYS HE'S SMART. AND TIM KAINE MADE THE POINT THAT, THAT MEANS THAT THE PEOPLE WHO PAY THE TAXES, WHETHER THEY'RE FIREFIGHTERS OR EMERGENCY ROOM NURSES THEY'RE DUMB. THE PEOPLE WHO PAY FOR SPECIAL EDUCATION TEACHERS PAY FOR COPS AND FIREFIGHTERS, THEY'RE DUMB. AND I THINK THAT'S THE WAY TO SEPARATE DONALD TRUMP FROM HIS CONSTITUENCY. I THOUGHT THAT WAS WELL DONE. BUT THERE WAS NO QUESTION, HE WAS YIPPY AND YAPPY LIKE A LITTLE PUPPY.

>> AMY WALTER ON THIS TAX POINT. DID -- WAS TIM KAINE RIGHT TO BRING IT UP AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN? OR ARE WE JUST TIRED OF HEARING ABOUT IT?

>> TIMECAPS JOB WAS PRETTY ESTIMATE TELL -- SIM KAINE'S JOB WAS TO REMIND THE VIEWERS, AT EVERY MOMENT, THAT THINGS THAT TRUMP HAS SAID AND DONE THAT ARE VERY DIFFICULT TO DEFEND. AND AS WE DISCUSSED PENCE HAD A VERY DIFFICULT TIME, SOMETIMES CLEARLY AVOIDED ANSWERING THOSE QUESTIONS. MIKE PENCE'S JOB WAS NOT ONLY TO DEFLECT BUT TRY TO BRING IT BACK. HE SOUNDED LIKE TRYING TO SHOEHORN IN THE E-MAIL SERVER IN AN UNRELATED QUESTION. OH, MAKE SURE TO GET THAT IN. AND THE CLINTON FOUNDATION, MAKE SURE YOU SHOEHORN THAT IN. BUT PENCE ALSO DID AT THE VERY BEGINNING HE TRIED TO DO IT AGAIN AT THE END TRIED TO GET IT IN THERE AT OTHER POINTS, THIS IS ABOUT STRENGTH, THIS IS ABOUT PUTTING AMERICA BACK ON TRACK. THIS MESSAGE OF CHANGE, THINGS AREN'T GOING WELL. IF YOU WANT CONTINUITY OF THE BAD THINGS THAT ARE HAPPENING NOW, THEN GO AHEAD VOTE FOR HILLARY CLINTON. IF YOU WANTED TO GO CHANGE YOU WANT STRENGTH, COME WITH US BUT THAT WAS HARD TO DO WHEN IT WAS A CONSTANT BARRAGE OF TRUMP STATEMENTS THAT HE HAD TO DEFEND AGAINST.

>> Woodruff: ISN'T THAT WHAT, I MEAN, TO PLAY DEVIL'S ADVOCATE HERE, MICHAEL, ISN'T THAT WHAT THE CLINTON CAMPAIGN NEEDS TO DO, TO KEEP REMINDING PEOPLE OF WHAT DONALD TRUMP HAS SAID?

>> YES. THE NUMBER OF ISSUES I THINK IT WORKED. GOVERNOR PENCE HAD A HABIT OF SAYING REASSURING THINGS ABOUT -- THAT HE CLEARLY BELIEVES ON RUSSIA OR SYRIA OR A LOT OF OTHER TOPICS, IT'S NOT CLEAR THAT DONALD TRUMP WOULD BELIEVE THOSE THINGS. OFTEN HAD TO DEFEND DONALD TRUMP BY EVERYTHING A DIFFERENT DONALD TRUMP. SAYING THIS IS NOT THE MAN YOU SEE, BUT YOU CAN LOOK AT THE RECORD. AND ULTIMATELY HE COULD WANT TO DEFEND ON THOSE ISSUES HAVING TO DO WITH CIVILITY AND CRUELTY AND TREATMENT OF WOMEN AND ALL OF THESE ISSUES THAT KAINE CAME BACK TO AGAIN AND AGAIN. THERE IS NO RESPONSE. THERE CAN'T BE RESPONSE. HE HAS NOT APOLOGIZED FOR THOSE THINGS. AND SO YOU CAN'T RESPOND - --

>> OR TRYING TO --

>> THAT WAS HIS ONLY -- A PIVOT.

>> THE ONE POINT HE SIMPLY SAID NOTHING. JUST WENT BACK TO THE QUESTIONER.

>> AFTER THE LITANY HE WENT THROUGH, HE DIDN'T SAY ANYTHING, ONE POINT WHERE I THOUGHT MODERATOR INSERT HERSELF TO SAY, DO YOU HAVE AN ANSWER FOR THAT?

>> Woodruff: WE HAVE LISA, WE'LL GO BACK TO FARMVILLE, VIRGINIA, TO LONGWOOD UNIVERSITY, LISA, YOU'VE BEEN TALKING TO SOME MORE CAMPAIGN REPRESENTATIVES?

>> THAT'S RIGHT. I THINK, JUDY, THIS THEME OF REAL FLIP IN THE EXECUTION OF TONE IS WHAT WE SEE HAPPENING. I JUST SPOKE WITH VIRGINIA SENATOR MARK WARNER USED TO BE THE GOVERNOR OF THIS FINE STATE. WHEN HE WAS GOVERNOR HIS LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR WAS TIM KAINE. FEW PEOPLE KNOW TIM KAINE BETTER I ASKED GOVERNOR WARNER WHAT ABOUT THIS ACCUSATION THAT TIM KAINE INTERRUPTED TOO OFTEN, PERHAPS HE WAS RUDE. MARK WARNER SAID, IF ANYTHING I WOULD NEVER IMAGINE CALLING TIM KAINE RUDE. PERHAPS THERE WAS SOME BACK AND FORTH, I SAID, NO, I COUNTED INTERRUPTIONS HE DID INTERRUPT FREQUENTLY, GOVERNOR PENCE DID AS WELL. HE SAID, NO, I THINK THIS IS -- FROM THE DEMOCRATIC VIEWPOINT WHAT GOVERNOR KAINE -- SENATOR KAINE WAS TRYING TO DO WAS TO GET GOVERNOR PENCE TO ANSWER FOR THE TRUMP CAP PAIN, I THINK DEMOCRATS SAY THAT THE PENCE-DONALD TRUMP. CAP PAGE DID NOT ANSWER THE ACCUSATIONS. ON THE OTHER HAND I TALKED TO ALABAMA REPUBLICAN SENATOR JEFF SESSIONS IS WHO SAYS THEY FELT THAT THE TONE FROM GOVERNOR PENCE SHOWED HE IS A HIGHER LEVEL PLAYER THAN WE SAW FROM THE CLINTON CAMPAIGN TONIGHT. AND FROM SENATOR KAINE. BUT MORE OVER, HE WAS TALKING ABOUT DEPTH OF POLICY FROM GOVERNOR PENCE. WE DID SEE SOME SERIOUS POLICY DISCUSSIONS TONIGHT AND HEAR THE TRUMP CAMPAIGN, IN PARTICULAR POINTED OUT FEELING THAT THEY MADE SOME INROADS THERE. OBVIOUSLY THAT'S FOR VIEWERS TO DECIDE SOMETHING THAT THE TRUMP CAMPAIGN IS CROWING ABOUT.

>> Woodruff: LISA TALKING TO REPRESENTATIVES OF THE CAMPAIGNS THERE AT THE DEBATE SITE AT LONGWOOD UNIVERSITY. AMY, THIS IS A POINT IN THE DISCUSSION WHEN WE GET TO, OKAY, HOW MUCH DIFFERENCE IS THIS GOING TO MAKE IN THE COURSE OF THE TRAJECTORY OF THIS CAMPAIGN, WHATEVER THESE TWO GENTLEMEN DID.

>> WE'VE SPENT WHOLE LOT OF TIME TALKING ABOUT TONE AND INTERRU INTERRUPTING, ALSO HAVE TO RECOGNIZE THAT MOST AMERICANS WHAT THEY'RE GOING TO SEE OF THIS DEBATE IS GOING TO COME IN 30-SECOND CLIPS THE MORNING SHORES WILL SHOW OR OTHER PROGRAMS LIKE YOU WILL SHOW TOMORROW NIGHT. AND SO IF IT IS AS MARK POINTED OUT THE RAT-TAT-TAT, DONALD TRUMP SAID THIS, THIS, THIS THE MT. RUSHMORE HE PUT OF THESE TERRIBLE PEOPLE LIKE PUTIN AND KIM JONG-UN THAT'S VICTORY FOR THE CLINTON CAMPAIGN DESPITE FACT FOR PEOPLE WHO WATCH IT DID NOT FEEL -- FELT VERY DIFFERENT FROM THAT. THAT IS GOING TO REALLY BE THE TRUE TEST ABOUT WHETHER THIS MATTERED OR WHETHER MIKE PENCE AND THE TRUMP CAMPAIGN CAN MAKE THE CASE THAT PENCE WAS THE MEASURED ONE. KAINE WAS THE ONE THAT WAS SORT OF SPIRALING OUT OF CONTROL. PENCE WAS THE ONE WHO CAN HANDLE BEING UNDER FIRE.

>> Woodruff: MICHAEL GERSON HOW DO YOU SEE THIS QUESTION OF HOW MUCH DO YOU SEE THE CAMPAIGN TAKING A DIFFERENT COURSE AS RESULT OF HOW WELL EITHER TIM KAINE OR MIKE PENCE DID TONIGHT?

>> WELL, AS I SAID EARLIER, REPUBLICANS WERE LOOKING FOR SOME KIND OF MORALE BOOST. THEY MAY HAVE GOTTEN SOME TONIGHT. MIKE PENCE WAS CALM, HE MADE THE BEST DEFENSE THAT HE COULDS REPUBLICANS WILL TAKE SOME HOPE FROM THAT GIVEN THE WEEK, THE HORRIBLE WEEK THAT THEY HAVE HAD. MISERABLE WEEK THEY HAVE HAD. REPUBLICANS -- DEMOCRATS WILL TAKE SOME HOPE THAT THIS CASE WAS PROSECUTED AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN AND WAS NOT ADEQUATE RESPONSE ON A NUMBER OF ISSUES. SO, I'M NOT SURE HOW MUCH DIFFERENCE THAT MAKES. BUT I THINK BOTH PARTIES WILL PROBABLY FIND SOME WAY TO PRAISE THIS PERFORMANCE.

>> Woodruff: REPUBLICANS TAKE SOME HEART, MARK. DEMOCRATS ARE PLEASED THAT TIM KAINE PROSECUTED THE CASE.

>> REPUBLICANS WILL SAY THAT MIKE PENCE LEGITIMATELY SO WAS UNFLAMMABLE. NO WAY USED THE STRATEGY THAT HILLARY CLINTON DID LAST WEEK TO GET UNDER HIS SKIN. THEY DID NOT GET UNDER MIKE PENCE'S SKIN. BUT THE PROBLEM IS, THAT SOME REPUBLICAN WILL SAY, GEE, IF ONLY THE TICKET WERE REVERSED AND THAT WILL NOT SETTLE WELL WITH THE TOP OF THE TICKET. IF THAT IS SAID ANYWHERE, ATTRIBUTE TO ANY REPUBLICAN THAT, GEE, PENCE DID MUCH BETTER JOB THAN TRUMP, IT WILL NOT PLEASE THE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE AND REPUBLICAN SIDE. ONLY OTHER THING WAS, THERE WAS A LITTLE HYPERBOLE I THOUGHT ON THE PART OF KAINE, HE WAS A LITTLE BIT TOO APPRECIATIVE OF HILLARY CLINTON. I MEAN, THERE WAS SORT OF A PORTRAIT OF HILLARY CLINTON THAT HE GAVE AS APPRECIATIVE RUNNING MATE THAT I THOUGHT WAS EXCESSIVE AT TIMES. IT SEEMED.

>> PERHAPS THE STATUS QUO ON THE ECONOMY NOT NECESSARILY THE BEST STRATEGY. COULD HAVE BEEN MORE PEOPLE TE WITH THE CONCERNS THAT A SIGNIFICANT PORTION OF THE AMERICAN PEOPLE FELT, LIKE DEFENSIVE BARACK OBAMA SOMETIMES. NOT JUST DEFENSE OF HILLARY CLINTON. ACTUALLY NOT THE PURPOSE HERE.

>> Woodruff: IT'S INTERESTING, MARK, YOU SAY HE WAS TOO INFUSIVE IN HIS PRAISE OF HILLARY CLINTON.

>> YES.

>> Woodruff: YOU SAY VERY PROUD TO SERVE WITH DONALD TRUMP. TICKED OFF THE REASONS WHY. JUST WONDERING HOW YOU STRIKE A BALANCE WHEN YOU ARE NOT THAT EXCITED.

>> I FELT THAT THERE WAS A CANNED -- ALMOST LIKE CLINTON PEOPLE HAD PREPARED TIM KAINE, THESE ARE THE POINTS YOU WANT TO MAKE ABOUT HOW WONDERFUL THE NOMINEE S. I FELT THAT EARLY. AS I SAY, WHEN HE GOT HIS FOOTING, I JUST THOUGHT THERE WAS NO QUESTION OVER THE LAST TWO-THIRDS OF THE DEBATE WHO WAS THE ALPHA MALE IN THE ROOM. TO PUT IT BLUNTLY. HE WAS DOMINANT, MIKE PENCE WHO WAS COOL AND CALM WAS REACTING AND PLAYING DEFENSE, YOU CAN'T SCORE ON DEFENSE.

>> Woodruff: SOME TIME, AMY, ONLY HAVE COUPLE OF MINUTES, THAT PEOPLE SPEND TIME SAYING, WERE THEY TARGETING THEIR BASE OR WERE THEY TRYING TO EXPAND THE BASE. HOW DID YOU SEE THAT?

>> VICE PRESIDENTIAL DEBATES ARE ALWAYS BASE ORGANIZED DEBATES. KNOWS ARE THE PEOPLE WHO ARE WATCHING THESE DEBATES NOT AS -- DON'T BRING IN AS MANY NEW VOTERS OR NEW VIEWERS, THAT'S WHAT THIS SEA BOUT. I AGREE COMPLETELY WITH MICHAEL THAT IT IS ABOUT REASSURING AND ENERGIZING THE PEOPLE THAT YOU NEED TO GET TO TURN OUT TO VOTE. BUT ALL OF THIS, OF COURSE, WILL BE SOON FORGOTTEN WHEN WE COME BACK HERE ON SUNDAY AND THE TWO MAIN CONTENDERS SHAPE UP AGAINST EACH OTHER. SO, THIS IS PROBABLY VERY SHORT-LIVED BOUNCE WHATEVER IT IS FOR EITHER CAMPAIGN.

>> Woodruff: QUICK FAY AWAY, MICHAEL?

>> ONE THING THAT WAS DIFFERENT FROM THE PRESIDENTIAL DEBATE WAS TALK ABOUT FAITH AND WHERE IT IS IMPORTANT TO -- THIS SHOWED DIVERSITY OF THE ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH. HOW BROAD THIS S. ALL THE WAY FROM A SOCIAL JUSTICE CATHOLICISM THAT PRO CHOICE IN CERTAIN WAYS ALL THE WAY TO PENCE'S EVANGELICAL CATHOLICISM. TALKING ABOUT PRO LIFE ISSUES. THEY BOTH MADE THEIR CASE. BUT THAT WAS A DEEPENING OF AN ARGUMENT.

>> Woodruff: TO MAN WHO GREW UP IN THE CATHOLIC CHURCH.

>> THE POINT IS, THAT THESE ARE SUPPOSED TO BE THE NICE GUYS. IT WAS PRETTY MUCH OF A BRAWL TWO, NICE GUYS.

>> Woodruff: I THINK BOTH ALTAR BOYS.

>> WAS MIKE PENCE AN ALTAR BOY?

>> WENT AWAY FROM COLLEGE AND --

>> Woodruff: MARK SHIELDS, AND AMY WALTER THAT WRAPS UP OUR COVERAGE OF THIS VICE PRESIDENTIAL DEBATE THERE'S WHOLE LOT MORE ONLINE WHERE YOU CAN WATCH HIGHLIGHTS AT PBS.ORG/NEWSHOUR PLUS POLITICS TEAM OF SHE AND DAN BUSH WILL BE TAKING YOUR QUESTIONS LIVE ON FACEBOOK THAT'S IN A FEW MINUTES THAT'S AT FACEBOOK L. COM/NEWS DID DRSHOUR. THANK YOU FOR JOINING US WANT TO YOU JOIN US RIGHT HERE FOR THE "NEWSHOUR" TOMORROW EVENING. FOR ALL OF US THE PBS "NEWSHOUR" WE THANK YOU, GOOD NIGHT.

>> MAJOR FUNDING FOR THIS PROGRAM HAS BEEN PROVIDED BY: PUBLIC BROADCASTING. AND BY CONTRIBUTIONS TO YOUR PBS STATION FROM VIEWERS LIKE YOU. THANK YOU. Captioning sponsored by NEWSHOUR PRODUCTIONS, LLC Captioned by Media Access Group at WGBH access.wgbh.org Election 2016 on PBS - One. - What's wrong with my running for president of this country? - I almost resent, Vice President Bush, your patronizing attitude that you have to teach me about foreign policy. - Ahh! - I'm doing this because I love you. - Tomorrow night my name will go on nomination for Presidency. - I will beat Al Gore like a drum. [cheers and applause] - I want my country back. [cheers and applause] - Mr. President, you were elected to lead. You chose to follow. And now it's time for you to get out of the way.